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Rinnai Corporation

Rinnai tankless hot water system

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Overall Rating: $$

Reviewed by 315 Greenerbuilding users - Write a review

The Rinnai tankless hot water system is revolutionizing the way modern homes meet their hot water needs. The Rinnai system can produce and supply endless streams of hot water to multiple outlets simultaneously without any fluctuation in temperature. The Rinnai tankless water heater is a small central heating unit that is up to 50 percent more energy efficient than a traditional natural gas water heater and is up to 70 percent more efficient than an electric water heater.

Unlike old technology water tanks that heat and reheat the same water 24 hours a day, the Rinnai tankless water heater is more efficient because it only heats water when it is needed. When a water source is opened, Rinnai senses the demand for hot water flow and starts the heating process. The water flows through a heat exchanger and is heated to the designated temperature set by the user.

The Rinnai system uses the feedback from a water flow sensor to adjust the fully modulating gas valve, giving users a consistent water temperature for any duration. When the water source tap is closed, Rinnai automatically shuts off until hot water is demanded again, providing significant energy cost reduction.

Each Rinnai system is installed by a Rinnai Certified Installer to assure quality care and proper fitting. All Rinnai systems are backed with a 10-year limited warranty on the heat exchanger and 5 years on the rest of the parts. A list of authorized distributors is available at www.foreverhotwater.com.

Showing 315 Consumer Reviews - Write a review

My Rating: $$

by Rinnai Tech Man (Atlanta, GA)

For Ross of Durham, NC,
Glad to hear of the success with your Rinnai unit ! It is amazing what some “fine tuning ” of outside influences will do for the performance .
Thanks for having the fortitude to “retract” your earlier statement of hating the Rinnai unit !
Best of luck !
Rinnai Tech Man

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Dated: 2010-09-10

My Rating: $$

by Ross (Durham, NC)

I want to retract my previous bad review of the Rinnai tankless hot water system. The gas company sent an expert to our house and in less than 30 minutes he made simple adjustments to solve all of the problems I was experiencing. Now I am a happy camper. There were several easy fixes that needed to be made. First one must understand this system is based on water flow, not heat sensors. The little water filters in your shower and the water flow pipes in your kitchen/bath need to be cleaned of grit so that water pressure is not inhibited. Secondly, our water pressure was set too low at the street. He only needed to slightly increase the water pressure coming into the house. Now that water filters have been cleaned and with a little increase in water pressure at the street, we have the flow to sustain the hot water operation. With old water heaters, you burn up energy 24 hours a day to keep many gallons of hot water at the ready. Now, with this hot water system, you only use energy when you need hot water, therefore, you need to learn to wait a few minutes for water to quit running cold and start running hot. This requires a simple change in the homeowners mindset. Now, once the hot water starts flowing … it will keep flowing when you have enough water pressure to sustain the hot water … because this system is built to work efficiently based on water flow and not heat sensors. You can set your Rinnai to heat to 120 degrees and mix hot and cold water as needed … with the right water pressure … hot water will continue to flow. BUT … I discovered … since the dishwasher includes the mechanism to reheat water to 140 … if you wish … you can set your Rinnai to 110 or 115 degrees (whatever your skin likes) ... turn your faucet all the way to hot and take a nice hot shower without even turning on the cold faucet to mix. If you need real hot water for laundry … press the button to heat at a higher temperature and then mix water. Most laundry can be done with cold water. Thanks to Rinnai, the Gas Co., and to the excellent gas company plumber!

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Dated: 2010-09-09

My Rating: $$

by Ross (Durham, NC)

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Dated: 2010-09-09

My Rating: $$

by pextubing (New York, NY)

You do good things … your advice is very helpful for me

PEXUniverse.com – homeland of pex tubing.

Fullfilled: GreenHome NYC

Dated: 2010-09-08

My Rating: $$

by Rinnai Tech Man (Atlanta, GA)

For Eric of Denver ,Colorado
Whenever you have a “noisy unit “upon start up , it wi;ll be an imbalnace of the fuel/air mixture . Have your installer check for proper incoming gas pressures when under a full gas load ( all gas appliances in the house should be on when checking incoming gas pressures) . Also the venting should be inspected to make sure there is no joint mialignment or ,if a pipe was cut to fit , make sure the proper distance was maintained when th pipe was cut . The installation manual is very clear as to this distance .
The unit going hot /cold/hot in the shower/tub could be attributed to incoming gas pressures or low volume through your shower head . The tube flows a lot of volume . If the incoming gas isn’t sufficient for the BTU load required by the tub fixture , then the unit could shut down .
I wonder if anyonne has seen a code on the temperature controller ? If not , then please check for a code . I realize when you are taking a shower it is not conveient to get out and check for a code but if the unit is locking out on a trouble code and you turn water flow off , it will reset the unit and cause it to refire .
The issue when using the shower could be attributed to having a low flow shower head . The unit needs approxiamtly 6 tenths of a gallon to fire . If you aren’t maintaining this number , the unit will shut off.
The MC91 yourefer to is the temperature controller .
Look at thg left hand side of unit (when facing unit ) for the complete model/serial number .
Please contact your service provider and have them come back out for diagnosis of these issues Make sure they have a manometer for checking incoming gas pressures .
Above all , Make sure they contact Rinnai Tech Support when on site for help with diagnosis .
Good luck !

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Dated: 2010-09-07

My Rating: $$

by Rinnai Tech Man (Atlanta, GA)

For Barry of Citrus Heights, California,
The installing company did you no favors by undersizing your system .
The two unit /seperate systems is a good alternative .
Another method would be to have a circulation loop installed with a small electric tank ccointrolled by an aquastat and pump . the Rinnain unit would supply the loop only when a demand is made on the system . The small tank/aquastat/pump would maintain the temperature in the loop , giving you “instant hot water ” at the fixtures . This does defeat the energy savings of using the Rinnai unit by having the pump/electric tank method . It is a “comfort feature ” only .
Hopefully the installing company installed the installation valve kit . This would allow for the flushing of the unit .
The unit is recommended to be flushed using virgin food grade vinegar or 8-10 % citric acid compound only . This prevents anything “caustic ” from coming into contact with your domestic water supply .
You or the service provider can shut the incoming/outgoing water off . Attach hoses to the appropriarte vavles . Attach the other side of the hoses to a circulating pump with at least 3GPM flow . Put 4 gallons of vinegar/ctric acid mixture into a 5 gallon bucket and let circulate for 1 hour .
The procedure can be accessed from Rinnai with illustration if needed .
Good luck with yor system upgrade !

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Dated: 2010-09-07

My Rating: $$

by Rinnai Tech Man (Atlanta, GA)

For Ross of Durham ,NC ,
The issue with water taking a long time to fixtures could be several things . The Rinnai unit shouldn’t take any longer than your original tank did . Crossover from fixtures will also affect the time hot water is delivered to the fixtuer , Water pipe sizing could also be an issue . Too large a pipe has to be filled before recieving water down stream . All Rinnai units are certified using 3/4” water lines .
The unit also has to have a minimum of 6 tenths of a gallon to fire .
If you have a low flow shower head and aren’t meeting the minimum flow rate , the unit could possibly do the hot/cold/hot .
On your temperature controller , you can press the up button for two seconds and (while still holding the up buton ) press the on/off button at the same time . Let go and this will show the GPM flow through the unit . A single digit showing ( 7) would be 7 tenths of a gallon . A double digit ( 21) would be two point 1 , two gallons and one tenth .
By doing the same combination except using the down button first , you will read the outgoing temperature from the unit . This is being measured at the outlet of the unit . You should be with in two to four degress of your set temperature .
Incoming gas pressure can also affect performance and cause hot/cold/hot issue .
Have yor service provider come out and contact Rinnai Tech Support for help with diagnosis .
No reason to have to “put up” with poor performance from your Rinnai unit due to outside influences !
Good Luck !

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Dated: 2010-09-07

My Rating: $$

by Eric (Denver, CO)

Over all our Rinnai is just average. It can be pretty noisy when starting up. Also we have this problem, with half way through a shower the water goes ice cold. You essentially have to turn off the water wait a minute or two and then finish your shower. Same thing for the Tub. We are in new construction and have only a single unit for a 2 bath house. Our Model is MC-91

Fullfilled: Built Green Colorado

Dated: 2010-09-06

My Rating: $$

by Barry (Citrus Heights, CA)

We’ve had our Rinnai R85 for three years now. Like others have said we wait forever for hot water. I don’t think this is the Rinnai’s fault though. We have a 4,000 sq ft home and have now been told that the R85 is much to small for our house. I am considering putting in a second Rinnai on the far side of the house and thus creating two zones. After reading these reviews I have learned for the first time that I should flush the system once a year. Anybody know how to do this?

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Dated: 2010-09-05

My Rating: $$

by Ross (Durham, NC)

I hate the thousand+ dollar Rinnai water heater the gas company sold me. Oddly enough, my wife and daughter think it’s okay. When you turn your hot water on, you’re going to wait a loooong time for cold water to actually start running warm (forget hot for a very long time). The wait time will depend on how far the cold water must travel to your Rinnai. In our case, it takes 2 minutes and 16 seconds before the water starts to feel warm and a lot longer before it actually gets hot. Meanwhile, a lot of gallons of unused precious water is going right down the drain. Then there’s the hot and cold shower! Oh my! The hot water turns off after a couple of minutes, and you either have to finish your shower with cold water, or stand back and wait 3 or 4 minutes until it gets hot again. All-in-all a whole lot of cold water is going down the drain and wasted. Then too, the gas company that sold this thing to me didn’t bother to tell me the Rennai tankless water heater has to be flushed out once a year; I didn’t know this until I read these reviews. If I would have read these reviews before I bought this water heater, and I should have, I never would have never bought the monster. You’re before off buying a gas water heater with a tank, unless this Green company figures out how to quit wasting water!

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Dated: 2010-09-02

My Rating: $$

by Ross (Durham, NC)

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Dated: 2010-09-02

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by Ross (Durham, NC)

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Dated: 2010-09-02

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by Ross (Durham, NC)

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Dated: 2010-09-02

My Rating: $$

by Ross (Durham, NC)

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Dated: 2010-09-02

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by Rinnai Tech Man (Atlanta, GA)

For Rod H. of Phoenix ,Az.
Several issues come to mind in regards to your unit giving a code 11.
The following is taken directly from the Rinnai Installation operation manual for your unit .
Code 11 has various causes as you can see .
Code11—No Ignition Check that the gas is turned on at the water heater, gas meter, or cylinder.
Ensure gas type and pressure is correct. Ensure gas line, meter, and/or regulator is sized properly.
Bleed all air from gas lines.
Verify dip switches are set properly.
Ensure appliance is properly grounded.
Disconnect all MSA controls.
Ensure igniter is operational. Check igniter wiring harness for damage.
Check gas solenoid valves for open or short circuits.
Remove burner cover and ensure all burners are properly seated.
Remove burner plate and inspect burner surface for condensation or debris.

As for having to wait for three weeks for an igniter module ….Rinnai has supply warehouses in Reno , Nevada and Peachtree City ,Georgia . Both provide overnight delivery for warranty issues .
The incoming gas as youn have reported is shown as 7”wc . There are two measurements required to give an accurate picture for the incoming gas . Static (Not running ) and Running (When the unit has fired ) . Static is the incoming pressure with no load applied . Running pressure is the actual pressure when the unit has fired and is drawing a load on the gas system .
Your particular unit (by having the 7”wc I take it to mean you have natural gas incoming ) should have between 6” to 10 1/2” wc Static / Running pressure should maintain above 6”wc with everything in the house that is supplied with gas turned on also . This is called a “Full Gas Load ” . Rinnai would also like to see no more than a 1” drop in pressure between Static and Running pressures .
If the incoming gas pressure drops below 6”wc on start up , you will get a code 11. The unit rectifies the ground using the flame . A code 11 tells me the PCB has never seen a flame. This could explain why the regulator was deemed faulty . By having too little or too much gas pressure , you can have the same results .Too much pressure will blow the gas through too fast for the unit to actually fire also

As for the replacement of the igniter , there are several simple tests that should have been performed before replacement occurred .
I see i,n one of your reviews ,you stated you had Code 11 and sometimes a Code 12 also . This is syptomatic with the burners possibly having corrosion/debris on them and also the flame rod /igniter could be compromised by thhis also .
I didn’t see where the burners/flame rod / igniter had been pulled and examined for this issue . The burners are stainless steel and can be cleaned with a small prpoane torch and then blowing through them with 100psi of compressed air . The flame rod/igniter are also stainless steel and can be cleaned using emery cloth .
There is a clear vinyl tube also that runs from the bottom of the heat exchanger to the front of the gas valve . If it has gotten any moisture inside it , it will compromise the gas valve and need to be replaced as a result . The cause of the moisture will need to be determined and corected (if applicable ) .

Please have you installer call Rinnai Tech Support for assistance when on site .
Make sure he has a manomter ( for gas pressure/volume check ) and an AC/DC multimeter for any voltage readings needed to be checked .
Good Luck

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Dated: 2010-08-30

My Rating: $$

by Rinnai Tech Man (Atlanta, GA)

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Dated: 2010-08-30

My Rating: $$

by Rod H (Phoenix, AZ)

I noted on my previous review the problems with my “Rinnai tankless hot water system” which was showing error 11 and the unit was not powering on; therefore, leaving me without hot water. The problem was intermittent. A licensed plumber was called out to work on the unit and he has been in contact with Rinnai technical support in an attempt to diagnose the problem. The plumber has been told three different reasons for the problem, which I list below:
1)The error 11 was due to an Igniter Module problem. The Igniter was replaced three weeks later (the part could not be found locally).
2)The error 11 continued. The plumber took a reading of the gas pressure coming into the unit and reported the information to Rinnai. Tech support now said the problem was due to low gas pressure coming into the unit. The local gas company was contacted and they reported there was plenty of gas coming in to power up a 4000,000 BTU unit (my unit uses 180,000 BTUs). They reported the gas pressure reading was at 7” WC, which was ideal for my unit.
3)The error 11 continued and Rinnai Tech support was contacted by the plumber again. The Rinnai Tech requested the gas pressure be checked. Now the gas pressure was too high and the plumber was told this was the cause of the problem; therefore, a gas pressure regulator had to be installed at my expense. I was told that if no regulator was installed and the unit failed it would void the warranty. Today, 08/26/2010, a “Maxitrol” gas pressure regulator was installed and the error 11 persists. The error 11 was intermittent, well now it’s almost impossible to get hot water since the error eleven keeps on coming on almost every time I turn on the hot water. Just as I suspected the problem was not the gas pressure.
The plumber will have to contact Rinnai again and I will have to set up yet another appointment to get the unit worked on. Every time I get an appointment they tell me the usual that the plumber will come to my home between 8 am and 1 pm. This problem started early July of this year and now is the end of August and the problem is yet to be fixed. This is getting to be very irritating, time consuming and expensive. The plumber has over 10 years of experience on his field and is Rinnai certified, so why this problem can’t be fixed in two months?
I thought I was doing the right thing by going green on the hot water heater, but this thing did not turned out be a money saver, a benefit to the environment, and it has not worked as advertised.

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Dated: 2010-08-26

My Rating: $$

by Rod H (Phoenix, AZ)

I got my Rinnai R53 installed almost 3 years ago. It never worked well in the master bedroom shower and we’ve had hot and cold water problems since day one. Last month it started having problems with the unit not coming on when the hot water was turned on and it gave an error 11 warning. I shut off the tap and turn it back on a few seconds later and this seemed to do the trick to get hot water. Now the problem occurs more often so I called a licensed plumber to fix it. The plumber called Rinnai since the unit is under warranty and he was told it was an igniter module problem. The part was ordered and 3 weeks later it was installed when it arrived directly from Japan. The problem continued and the plumber re-contacted Rinnai tech support who asked that the gas pressure be checked. It was checked and the plumber was told it was too low. The gas company was called out and they reported the incoming gas volume and pressure was at 7” Water Column and enough to power up a 400,000 BTU unit (my unit use 180,000BTUs).
Now the unit is showing error 11 and sometimes error 12. The plumber was called out again and Rinnai (3rd technician) was called. The plumber was asked to check the gas pressure again. Now they say the gas pressure is too high and I need to install an interior pressure regulator. This will cost me 0.00 out of pocket. So far the Home Warranty and Rinnai will not cover this cost since it is not the unit itself that is malfunctioning. Over ,000.00 in cost and no consistent hot water supply. I suspect the gas pressure regulator will be installed and the unit will not work properly (my gut feeling).
I do not recommend this type of water heater. Not worth the cost, the hassle, and definitely not reliable to produce hot water 100% of the time.

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Dated: 2010-08-25

My Rating: $$

by Rinnai Tech Man (Atlanta, GA)

For Russell Nunnally of Richmond ,VA.
The Code 12 is an indication that the unit has had a flame failure . This would mean the unit actuallly saw a flame but couldn’t maintain the proper incoming fuel/air ratio and went to the code 12 .
The issue with turning on another faucet and having hot water is when you turn water flow off it will “resest” the error code .
You should contact your installer and have them check the incoming gas supply for Static and running pressures . Also make sure there hasn’t been something that is partially covering the vent termination .
If needed, have the installer contact Rinnai Tech Support while on site for help with diagnosing issue .
800-621-9419
Good luck !

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Dated: 2010-08-18

My Rating: $$

by Russell Nunnally (Richmond, VA)

We have had a Rinnai R94 LSI for about a year. It was the greatest thing. Now most of the time when you turn the hot water on, you don’t get hot water. I have found that the temp on the unit goes from 120 to 12 and a buser goes off. Also, I found that if I go to another focet and turn it on (once or twice) and go back to the first focet, the water gets hot.

Is the 12 a code?

Thanks

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Dated: 2010-07-13

My Rating: $$

by tom (Casper,, WY)

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Dated: 2010-07-13

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by tom (Casper,, WY)

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Dated: 2010-07-13

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by tom (Casper,, WY)

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Dated: 2010-07-13

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by tom (Casper,, WY)

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Dated: 2010-07-13

My Rating: $$

by Mojo (CLT, NC)

Grayce Green-
I’ve been having the same problem with my brand new 98 external condensing unit (RC98HPE). It turns out the plumber (who blames the HVAC guy) didn’t install a condensate drip line on the condensate drain line. The unit actually had a black cap on the drain from the manufacturer that should’ve been removed. Without the condensation dripping away, the unit will shut down after a few minutes of use. Prolonged use with it plugged will actually damage the unit and void the warranty. Good luck.

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Dated: 2010-07-12

My Rating: $$

by GetAGoodPlumber (Morganton, NC)

Installed Rinnai 94LS in Mountains. Love the unit. Have had two problems. During high winds (30mph+) blowing at 90deg to my exhaust, it’s creating a suction and blowing out the Flame (Error 12). Will need to install some type of obstruction to wind (landscaping). Also, Had a mouse crawl into exhaust and stop fan causing “Combustion Exhause Fan problem”. Apparently there’s some type of screen (0) to install to prevent critters/instect entry. These are specific installation issues applicable for any Tankless system. Overall very happy w/performance of unit. Get good builder/Plumber for installation though.

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Dated: 2010-07-07

My Rating: $$

by Grayce Green (Tampa, FL)

I absoutely HATE my Rinnai tankless hot water heater. With the City of Tampa telling us not to waste water, I waste it every time I turn on my faucets, since it takes forever for the hot water to come out.

Also, when taking a shower, the hot water turns off after a couple of minutes, and you either have to finish your shower with cold water, or wait 3 or 4 minutes until it gets hot again. I’ve had the Rinnai authorized service plumbers out here 4 times, and they keep telling me that the Rinnai is working perfectly. The plumber was here again this week and told me that the problem was my shower head.

Since we now are required to use low-flow shower heads, the Rinnai system

is totally ineffective, and is a waste of our already diminishing water supply.

The concept is obviously a very good one; however, the actual product needs to be re-engineered to work effectively with low-flow water distribution. Environmently conscious current owners with problems either need to be reimbursed financially or have the system replaced with a WORKING model.

Not only would I not recommend this system to anyone, I would actively discourage them from even considering this product!!!

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Dated: 2010-07-01

My Rating: $$

by DRH (Newnan, GA)

Jack in Melrose, MA.

If you want immediate hot water at the tap you will need to look into installing a circulation system in your plumbing system in order to maintain hot water instantly at every tap. Check with the company that installed the unit for you. I would suggest installation of an “On Demand” system which will ensure full product warranty. This type system circulates the water on demand via a button pushed when you enter the room or a motion sensing device. Good luck.

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Dated: 2010-06-04

My Rating: $$

by Jack (Melrose, MA)

Rinnai Tankless System works as advertised but I am disappointed on the time it
takes to get hot water to the destinations (sinks, baths, etc) 30 to 60 seconds.
depends on how far away the faucet is. Once on , it works great so far. Have had it
on only 2 months. I would like to know, how to speed up the delivery time. Anyone know?

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Dated: 2010-05-24

My Rating: $$

by Linda M (Marietta, GA)

I’ve just finish installing a R50LS tankless unit. Luckily a family member works in the gas provider industry. So, I was able to get solid advice about the option of spending more to go tankless. Contractor quotes I receive ranged around 00. The unit itself cost about double the cost of replacing my old water heater. With Federal and State rebates of 0, the cost reduces to about the same. A bit of a no brainer as far as purchasing the product. The installation was the budget crasher. Unforeseen cost happened when we realized my gas and water lines were 1/2”. Replacing everything with 3/4” pipes increased material and labor cost 0 brining the total cost to 00. With help, it took three full days of crawling around under the house, hooking up new lines, to complete. I have a new appreciation for plumbers and electricians. Thankfully, I have both in my family. The new unit looks great and so far, works flawlessly. It will probably take a year of reduced gas expense to recoup the extra cost, but definitely worth it. My advice is to be absolutely sure of the water and gas line pressure before making a decision. Since I was involved in the labor end of the installation, I understand better the complications described in previous reviews listed here. While I am by no means qualified after this project, my guess would be most problems with temperature, distance traveled, and possibly noise would track back to psi delivered vs. the btu’s needed. It’s a bit more complicated I’m sure, but definitely the question to be answered in estimating the cost.

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Dated: 2010-05-23

My Rating: $$

by bill (pittsburgh, PA)

save money and agravation check out “hot water lobster”

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Dated: 2010-05-03

My Rating: $$

by pms (big bear, CA)

R75lsi: Great heater with two problems (one a significant design flaw).

Problem: I must run one gallon of water in order to get warm/hot water. What this means is if I want to just wash my face, or if I am doing the dishes turning on/off the water to save water, I simply just don’t bother using hot water. It is great for showers and laundry etc. but the design in not conducive for small volume applications.

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Dated: 2010-03-17

My Rating: $$

by eric (mountain view, CA)

every time we turn on the hot water we here a beep pretty loud when unit calls for water is anyone else having this problem we have had to rinnai reps come out both said this is normal but it wakes the wife op this beep also occurs when toilet is flushed added check valve on cold water did not help

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Dated: 2010-03-04

My Rating: $$

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Dated: 2010-01-26

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by Rich (Waterloo, IL)

Customer Service score for Rinnai is Below Average.

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Dated: 2010-01-26

My Rating: $$

by Joseph W Matousek (Grover Beach, CA)

Have had my Rannai water heater for 5 years and couldn’t be happier. Have 4 bathrooms and it will supply all showers at one time at 125 degrees. The only thing I would do different is I would put in a recirc pump so the hot water would not take as long to reach the second floor master bathroom approx. 75’ away

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Dated: 2010-01-23

My Rating: $$

by Ken (Red Deer, AB)

I have an R94LS that works well for the most part. I use it for domestic hot water and heating the underfloor concrete slab in my home. It has worked well since it was installed by a qualified plumber a year ago.

Recently as we got into the heating season it has been cycling fast and slow complete with the loud clacking of the solenoid as it starts the heating of the floor. It can take up to one hour for the rinnai to stabilize and run consistently at the same speed. I have the temperature controller set to 140F and this setting gives me the fastest heating of the slab through the heat exchanger.
If I lower the temperature to 130F the unit will stabilize almost right away but it takes longer to heat the slab. My plumber backwashed the rinnai with vinegar for 45 minutes several weeks ago but it has gone back to the cycling problem at 140F.

I have never had an LC trouble code although I have had several code 10’s. The code 10 is totally due to a fog condition in the atmosphere that builds up hoar frost on the outside intake of the two part exhaust/intake pipe. Any ideas would be appreciated on this issue.

Our water is not that hard but may be on the border for acceptable input to the rinnai. I am thinking of trying the hot towel on the gas regulator but the gas line has worked well in the past.

My Rating: $$

by James Dodd (Monroe, TN)

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Dated: 2009-11-23

My Rating: $$

The second thing to look at is the installation. If these units are installed internally, make sure the vent system either has a condensate collector in place on each unit or the venting for each unit is sloped towards the outside of the building (away from the unit). Condensate is an indicator of a high efficiency product functioning properly. Condensate is highly corrosive and must be drained away from the product. If allowed to run back into the product condensate can cause damage to any part it comes in contact with.

My experience with Rinnai is that they will honor their warranty if the product failure is related to a manufacturing defect. Unfortunately, neither water quality or condensate would be considered as a manufacturing defect.

Hope this helps. If you need additional information or assistance I would suggest you call Rinnai’s toll free # 800-621-9419.

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Dated: 2009-09-16

My Rating: $$

by DH (Newnan, GA)

To Tim in Edmonton who experienced problems with freezing of the heat exchanger in his Rinnai tankless unit last winter. The Rinnai tankless water heater does have freeze protection which is normally good to somewhere around -22 F (up there that’s -30 C). They use ceramic heaters which are placed throughout the unit that are activated at pre determined temperatures to provide heat around the heat exchanger. If the temperature drops below these pre determined temps and the ceramic heaters can’t overcome the drop in temperature, the unit is designed to actually come on (fire) periodically to move water through the heat exchanger. The key here is you have to have power and gas to the unit at all times for the freeze protection system to operate properly. You loose power or gas and it gets to cold, you could see a heat exchager freeze up. Rinnai has an accessory valve available called a drain down valve that will drain water out of the product if there is a loss of power. You might want to consider installing one of these to protect the system.

I know it gets colder than all get out up there in Canada, so taking some precautionary measures to protect the unit from extreme cold (and anything in the negative numbers is cold to anyone) is a good idea.

Hope this helps.

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by Louis Jimenez (Pompano Beach, FL)

While the Rinnai system is a very good system. The buyer needs to be aware that when these systems break down, whatever electrical usage savings you had will go out the door. My system broke down today and I had to pay a plummer an hour to come see what was wrong. The Rinnai 1616 that I have has an electrical power source. Today that powersource failed, and there is no way to troubleshoot the system other than calling a plummer at the tune of an hour. Rinnai wasn’t very helpful on the phone.

SO if you are planning to purchase one of these to save $$$ on electric bills, you may want to re-think this purchase. Next time this sucker goes down, I am switching back to old reliable, it never broke, nor did I have to pay someone an hour to come check it out.

Fullfilled: N/A

Dated: 2009-04-17

My Rating: $$

by Steve (Wernersville, PA)

I’ve had this Tankless water heater for about a month now. Fantastic product. I love mine. I would never – EVER - go back to a tank water heater. You must understand that there are some minor differences between the tank and the tankless water heaters.

People talk about cold water sandwiches. I can confirm that they are real, but they are very unnoticeable-to the point that I have to actually try to feel them. The way I see it is this: The cold water sandwich that comes with a tankless water heater is NOTHING compared to the HUGE cold water sandwich that comes when my old tank water heater ran out of hot water.

The unit itself is very quiet. The sound is kind of like a whir of a turbine combined with a fan-but very quiet. I would say that the noise from the unit is no louder than the sound of water running through the pipes. One could very easily carry on a normal conversation while the unit is running-in fact I have.

I don’t notice any real increase in time to get hot water to the spigot, either. If there is any increase in time it is probably only a couple seconds.

I love the additional space in the utility room.

The biggest problem I have is kinda funny. I get in the shower in the morning half asleep like a lot of people. Before I got the Rannai I used to stand there in the hot shower until it started turning cold (tank ran out of hot water). Then, I would quickly finish up – get out and get to work in time. Now that the water doesn’t turn cold I stay in the shower too long and I’ve been a little rushed to get to work in time. What a nice problem to have.

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Dated: 2009-04-15

My Rating: $$

by Bertram Johnson (Santa Maria, CA)

SAMPLE OF CUSTOMER NO SERVICE FROM RINNAI:

QUETION: Will it be harmful to the tankless water heater if I was to flush the system AS DIRECTED with vinegar once a month? You see I have very hard water and do not want to install a water conditioner.

RESPONSE: Dear Bertram Johnson Thank you for contacting Rinnai.

Here are two pieces of periodic maintenance that you or your service technician can perform to keep your Rinnai tankless water heater running smoothly:

In-line screen filter should be checked periodically for debris: (Period between filter checks will be dependent on water quality). Insure incoming water is turned off. The filter is located on inlet fixture below cabinet. Unscrew plug to remove. Expect some water drain off. Filter is a cylindrical screen.

Also, flush the unit periodically (Period between flushes will be dependent on water quality). This process will keep the unit free of scale and lime

If you need any assistance please let us know.

by Fran Jones (Greenville, NC)

These products blow. I have two on my house, one works the other sucks. I have spent 0 on “service” to try and get it functioning properly to no avail.

by Bill (Philly, PA)

This is a question to Dan in MT.

Why would you expect Rinnai to respond to an issue with your local installer messing up and installing your unit so it could freeze?
Obviously, the unit doesn’t have any capacity to warm your pipes or keep itself from freezing, so the Rinnai company isn’t involved in that kind of issue.
And the training program from Rinnai should be focused on how to install the unit, which again, doesn’t involve concerns over freezing.
So, did you contact your better business bureau over your installer?
Did you take him to small claims court?
Did you do anything to focus your attention on your installer, rather than the manufacturor of the hardware he used?
What exactly could you expect Rinnai to do about a freezing problem, revoke their certification for your installer? (how would that help you?)

It just seems to me, people focus on the hardware manufacturer when the problem is a freezing problem which of course could happen if your installer had choosen just about any other hardware and installed it wrong.

I guess you didn’t specifiy anything in your contract with your installer that it “would not freeze up” based on where you live?

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Dated: 2009-03-12

My Rating: $$

by dan (kalispell, MT)

My experience with Rinnai was lousy. First their distributor in the Bitterroot just plain lied to me about both the effectiveness of this system and the “training” of the guys who installed it.

After spending over 00 the unit froze up and burst the pipes the first time the outside temperature went below zero. After calling Rinnai, the distributor, and the installer I realized they all had no interest in fixing the problem or in repeat business from me. (I also own a Rinnai space heater.) The Rinnai “training” program is a joke. They only want to warranty their product when it is installed by their certified installer—I have no problem with that. However, when carelessly installed in a freezing environment the customer get perturbed. And I’ve traveled around northern Japan and seen many of these units, so I know it can be done.

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Dated: 2009-03-09

My Rating: $$

by Bill (Philadelphia, PA)

I’m getting ready to purchase a home built one hundred and fifty years ago.
Among other issues, it has an electric hot water tank to avoid having to vent.
I’m planning on solving the venting problem to get away from the high cost of electric.

Since the house was built without any pipes, the pipes in the house are all replacements. (of course, they could be 70 years old and considered a new upgrade for this house)

I love this blog, as it shows what to do to succeed and also provides a lot of great entertainment. It is amazing just how silly human beings are and how willing they are to blame others for their own inability to listen and learn.

1) I realize if my water pipes are too restricted, I will need to upgrade them or pay to preheat tons of water a year for the privledge of pushing water through a small pipe. Others don’t seem to want to look into that issue.

2) I realize if I stand in my shower and mix in a bunch of cold water, it could squeeze the demand for hot water so low that my hot flow will stop and freeze me. Not understanding the basics of how this system works is what makes me laugh at others the most. So I know I’m going to get a controller solution for my showers to avoid the problem of being stupid, and at the same time make the system work even better as it knows exaclty what I’m doing with the hot water. (Taking a shower)

3) I realize that using gas to heat water quickly, will reaquire a punch from the gas company, something that my house was not ‘sized’ for. So if I don’t ensure the gas company is feeding what I need, I won’t blame my water heater company for knowing even less about my own house. (I also won’t blame by stove company!)

4) I realize I have to clean a water heater each year. Does everyone know if they flush their huge tabk water heaters they also would last longer? And if you get a water softner, your dishwasher lasts longer as well as your washer, and your water heater?

5) I realize there are scumbags out their doing plumbing work. I’m not going to blame the device manufacturer for my inability to get references from REAL people and interview my selection to make up my own mind.

6) I realize that the distance between my old water heater and my new water heater is the same distance so it won’t send hot water FASTER.

7) I realize that I’m not super heating water in a storage tank so it will take a little longer to deliver hot water the exact same distance.

8) I realize if I upgrade the diameter of the water pip leaving my water heater, it will be pushing more water volume and take longer.

9) I realize if my system works well for a month, and then starts to have lower volume, or other delivery problems, something could be plugging up the gas line or the water lines and I need to have something actually measure that rather than blame the applicance iteself.

10) I realize almost every single person that complains about the process on this blog, doesn’t understand at least one of the prior nine things I’ve mentioned.

I’ve come to the above 10 realizations by merely reading the helpful posts of the people on here willing to explain the science involved. Problems like plumbing doing a backdraft, or circling the house, or being cross linked are not deficiencies of the appliance itself and should be corrected even with an old super tanker hot water heater.

I get a lot of chuckles from people that expect hot water to be heated through magic.
It’s science. It’s simple science. It’s simple enough, that if you read what the helpful people post on this one blog alone, you can interview people and find someone to completely solve these problems. (unless having old pipes that are way too small is something financially unfixable in which case, you shouldn’t even be going down this path——just keep three days worth or hot water preheated twenty-four hours a day and be done with it)

Again, thanks to the helpful posters that provide the science behind the process.
No matter what unit you buy, the science issues need to be resolved or you’ll have these issues. Most issues appear to have NOTHING to do with Rinnai and would be a problem for any tankless unit.

Oh, and to the idea that consumers should not be allowed to buy a unit on eBay and install it….. I fell off my chair laughing so hard.
What a silly idea.

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Dated: 2009-03-04

My Rating: $$

by Ken (Raleigh, NC)

You need a serious amount of gas to run these guys. Like 180,00 BTUs. That’s alot. A typical gas tank heater only requires about about 40,000. We streched the limits of our gas line. It’s about a 75 foot run to our main. So to put both the gas furnace and the new tankless on the same line required about 240,000 BTUs total. Which because of the distance was pushing it. We were hesitant at first about doing this. The PSNC guy said he needed to run dedicated hardline all the way up to the attic which would have added about 00 for parts and labor. We got another quote and talked to another guy and he said as long as you understand the limits of the unit you should be ok. We have had the heat on with 2 showers and a faucet and we are good. No problems. I love the endless hot water. Now we can use our garden tub and still take endless showers. It’s sweet. The wait time for the water is the same as it was. Our hot water is in the attic so it always took a long time to get it down to the first floor. I would definately recommend the Rinnai unit.

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Dated: 2009-03-01

My Rating: $$

by Larry (Owen Sound, ON)

I have inmstalled a Rinnai R85 (2532FFUC) unit a year ago to heat my in floor hydronic heating and for hot water supply.

People!
You have to flush this unit out once or twice per year to eleiminate the lime or scale buildup from the unit. Pressure will drop and hot water supplies will diminish. Scale will build up and eventually flake off and clog up you hot water taps, valves and screens.

I live on a well, with a water softener but still have to descale the unit once or twice per year a well as flush out the filter occasionallyl If you leave it too long the taps will need to have the screens removed and rinsed or flushed out, during or after the vinegar rinse. A small sump pump for under 0, two washine machine hoses, and a gallon of vinegar running for an hour will do a wonderful job and alleviate most of the problems heard on here.

by Bernie Glier (Richmond, BC)

My Rinnai R53 provides good hot water and pressure.The only complaint i have is the cluncking noise from the unit each and evertime i turn on the hotwater.Three consistant cluncks each time.Anyone have any ideas as to what this might be or how to fix it.

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Dated: 2009-02-20

My Rating: $$

by John Dawsey (Edwards, CO)

My wife and I have been going through a major home remodel and decided to install a tankless water system based on everything I read about their energy efficiency. We purchased the Rinnai 94sl based on a recommendation from the dealer. I was initially concerned about the fact that we live at 7,800 ft in the Rocky Mountains, but was assured this model would provide sufficient heat rise to our ground water and adequately service our 2,800 ft, 3 1/2 bath home. We are at the very end of the remodel project and when we finally fired up the unit, the most unusual thing happen. Two new vanities in Master Bath, one sink had good hot water while the other was ice cold. These are located about 25 feet from the Rinnai unit, but next to one another. At first I though maybe the plumber had criss-crossed the hot & cold lines on the one sink. Be I saw that wasn’t the case. I then discovered we were receiving good hot water out of the utility sink & kitchen, both of which are located within a few feet of the unit, yet ice cold water out of all other fixtures in the house. The technician turned off the hot water valve to the Rinnai and found that you could still receive water (cold) out of the hot spickets. He said there must be some type of “cross-over” in the plumbing- basically that a hot and cold line where connected somewhere in the house.

Dated: 2009-02-14

My Rating: $$

by Joe (Rochester, NY)

Randy,
I will be really dissapointed if Rinnai doesn’t cover that. I contacted them last month and they helped me with a few questions I had before I flushed the system with vinegar to delime it. Rinnai always stood behind their warranty. I hope that isn’t changing. Let us know how you make out.

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Dated: 2009-02-03

My Rating: $$

by Randy (Galesburg, IL)

I bought the rinnai R75 in Sept. of 2008. I had a licensed installer put it in on Nov.28, 2008. The heater has always made a rumbling noise on the first shower of the day. It would stop making the noise after about 20 seconds and work fine. On Jan. 16, 2009 the temperature got down to -28 below zero. When we went to use the hot water in the morning we had water coming out of the heater itself. We looked at the heater and it looks like a pipe burst in it. The heater is in a heated basement and is on the east wall so it doesn’t get the wind blowing on it.
I have read the warranty and there is nothing in it about a pipe bursting. It has 10 years on the heat exchanger, 5 years everything else and 1 year on the labor. As far as I can read the heater should be covered for 5 years.
I have got on there web site and it says the heater is good for -30 below zero. If it gets colder than that it is supposed to dump the water out of it to keep it from breaking. It did not dump the water out of it to keep from breaking.
So I have contacted Rinnai and they are telling me the heater is not covered because the pipe broke.
Is this heater covered by the warranty or not. This would be a very expensive heater if it doesn’t.
Someone please get back to me at my e-mail which is randyol@frontiernet.net
Thank You
PS
The heater was workingreally good until it broke.

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Dated: 2009-02-01

My Rating: $$

by Keith (Boca Raton, FL)

I have not purchased one of these units and was just reviewing everyones comments.

It seems most people are not happy with there unit. I may reconsider purchasing one for awhile.

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Dated: 2009-01-31

My Rating: $$

by carolyn (sacramento, CA)

I would never again install a Rinnai unit again! Unit doesn’t work, was undersized, and improperly installed by a “certified” rinnai installer, which means some they paid Rinnai some money to take a 4 hour installation class. After 2 months of trying to get the tankless heater installation corrected I contacted Rinnai who then gave me a list of “certified” installers most of which had no contractor license, on probation or suspended license. Even though Rinnai claims they want the problem resolved , they have done nothing to help – not even removing the crooked plumbers from their advertised Rinnai-certified list. Through this long, disappointing process I found that reputable plumbers install Noritz units on contracted projects and their own homes. Save your self some headaches and purchase a Noritz; next time I will!

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Dated: 2009-01-30

My Rating: $$

by JR (Ottawa, ON)

We had an RS 75 installed a few months ago. Initially we had problems with low water pressure and water was not very hot. We then discovered our ceritified installers did not ensure the piping was to code. They came back and installed 11/4 inch pipe to replace the previous 1inch (40 ft out of 60). I then increased the temperature to 125 (it gets very cold outside in winter). Both problems were resolved and we are very happy with the unit.

The coldwater sandwich only occurs in the first few seconds (30-60) then its consistent hot water. That’s not much different than the conventional hot water tank were it took at least 30 sec for the cold water to exit before I could jump into the shower.

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Dated: 2009-01-25

My Rating: $$

by Double D (Kansas City, MO)

Most of the complaints written in this blog are common complaints that are easily rectified by an Authorized Service Provider, but I can tell you from experience most are installation problems. I would always suggest standing in front of the heater and calling technical service at Rinnai. 1-800-621-9419
They can walk you through several steps to diagnos the issue.

It sounds like many of the problems occur during the winter months, such as hot cold, hot cold problems. I would question the gas pipe sizing as a culprit. Tank type heaters traditionally use burners at 40,000 btu, where a tankless heater modulates from 15,000 to 199,000 btu. Many contractors do not realize that the gas line may have to be replaced and upsized. I have met contractors who have practiced plumbing for more than 30 years and they do not have a clue on how to properly size gas lines. When the furnace and other gas appliances kick on and starve the water heater you can get terrible fluctuations in water flow and temperature.

If you are getting hot water at one faucet and have problems at another it is not the fault of the heater, the plumbing must now be checked. Pressure balance and thermostatic shower valves need a good mix of hot and cold to operate correctly. Setting the tankless at 120 degrees gives a good mix of hot and cold. Setting the temperature higher will mean less hot and more cold. Keep in mind most people bathe in 105 to 108 degree water. You will need a flow rate of .6 gpm to keep the water heater running.

Venting issues also cause a lot of problems. Venting under overhangs, to close to bushes or corners will cause the unit to have issues which will make it shut down, again hot cold issues will happen.

Cold basements should not be an issue on providing hot water, the units have freeze protection to -30 degrees, in fact my heater is an exterior unit and I have not had an issue in over 2 years since it was installed. As a service provider for over 2 years I have found 95% of the over 150 heaters that I have serviced had installation issues. Once the issues were rectified the complaints disappeared.

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Dated: 2009-01-19

My Rating: $$

by Buzz71 (Rochester, NY)

Just had a Rinnai R75i put in, and it has meet my expectations. I have good water quality and good pressure. I think there is a misconception out there about tankless water heaters. People have asked me do you get the hot water fast? The tankless heaters don’t give you hot water faster, if anything they take a little longer. The unit needs to detect water flow before ignition. Approximately 4 seconds then the heating proccess begins. The travel time for the hot water to get to your faucet/shower/dishwasher is the same. Unless you install the unit in a different location then your old hot water tank. Up here in upstate NY the water temp coming into the house is around 40 degrees F so that doesn’t help either. I also have had the “cold sandwich” happening, but it only happens when the hot water has been used then has been shutdown and started up again. The pipes are still warm, so you get that water 1st then you get the cold slug cause of the 4 seconds of flow needed before the heating proccess to begin. It makes sense to me. It’s just a thing you’ll get used to. But the showers are fantastic, hot water all shower long and very consistant. No adjusting needed during the shower once I get the temp set where I want it.

by James S (Red Deer, AB)

I installed our rinnai (REU V2532) five years ago in our new home. We love it. I intentionally took the certification course for installer so that I could install the Rinnai in my own house. Five years later and as well as taking Rinnai service courses I have learned a few things about living with a Rinnai.
-The cold sandwich effect can be caused by a number of different thing. Most of these are not the fault of the water heater.

1. poor water quality. Manganese seems to be the worst for plugging the inlet filter. If you notice a drop in flow check and clean your inlet filter but also check your flow restricters at your faucets. If you have a lot of minerals in your water add a water softener or clean your rinnai often (vinager wash).
Wells can be tricky. You need to ensure that you water pressure stays relatively constant and is set high enough. I like to keep the cut in pressure at around 40-45 PSI with a 15-20 PSI differential. 2. owner habits. If you turn your hot water on then off and back on again you will have a cold shot of water heading up the pipes. If more then 1 fixture is being used at a time the rinnai will still produce the same amount of hot water. This shows up as reduced flow at the taps as the hot water is now serving more then one location. Simply turn your cold tap down a bit. 3. Poor or faulty plumbing. Design is very important but sometimes even the best designed system will have a faulty part. If your water heater is also serving as a space heater there maybe a failed back flow preventer that occasioally allows cold water to bypass the Rinnai and head up the hot water lines.
The most common problem I have seen have been with anti scald devices. These have been both stand alone mixing valve and tap sets with antiscald built in. It is hard to explain to a homeowner that the reason they are either freezing or frying while showering has nothing to do with there water heater. The simplest way to prove it is if you draw hot water directly from the Rinnai (through pressure relief if you don’t have a hose bib) while continually monitoring the out going water temp. This can be done through the wall control.

Over the past 5 yrs the company that I work for has only installed a hundred or so Rinnai water heaters. Of those installed by us and other companies in the area I have only had to repair 2 unit. 1 failed circuit board do to lightning (I recommend a whole home surge protector to anyone with modern electronics in their home) , and 1 heat exchanger because the home owner used their wood fireplace without any inlet air at -30 degrees celcius.

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Dated: 2008-12-31

My Rating: $$

by Jean (Wynantskill, NY)

Our Rinnai “tankless hot water heater” is a nightmare and as soon as possible, we will replace it. In the meantime, we have heard installing a “chili pepper water circulation pump” will correct the current hot/cold flow. Has anyone tried this and has it helped? Thanks for your input! Sorry you are suffering along with us; but, it’s good to know we’re not the only ones who have been sold a badly engineered product.

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Dated: 2008-12-29

My Rating: $$

by Steve (Madison, CT)

We had a Rinnai R94LS installed in our home in October to replace a 30 Gal Oil Fired HW heater. We love our Rinnai. It provides us continuous hot water and we can run both showers together without any problems. I believe there are two key things necessary for happiness with these units:

1. Good consistent water supply – we are on a well with an excellent pumping system. We have about 70psi of pressure, but I don’t believe that much pressure is needed for good operation.
2. A good install – our installer does at least 2 per week and are very knowledgeable of what is needed to install it properly.

I have the water temp set to 130 degrees and all is fine. I would say the only downside (and this is minor), if the hot water has not been run for several hours it takes a little longer for it to reach the furthest faucet. We have already seen our electric bill go down and fuel usage (propane) is better than we had expected.
Hope this helps others considering a tankless unit as I was initially concerned after reading some of the posts here. All -in-all we are very happy with our Rinnai.

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Dated: 2008-12-17

My Rating: $$

by kevin (washington, DC)

I am having some of the same problems listed below, mainly the sinks in my home have ample hot water with our new tankless R63LSe but when I run the shower for more thank about 5 minutes we don’t get enough hot water to keep the shower warm. If I run the hot water in one of the sinks at the same time the amount of hot water coming out of the sink is a trickle.
I would love to take a look at Mickk’s checklist or troubleshooting guide but cant seem to find where it is located. Can someone post the link or email it to me?
If anyone has any ideas how to solve my problem I am all ears.
Thank you,
Kevin.geze@gmail.com

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Dated: 2008-12-16

My Rating: $$

by Doug (Alexandria, NH)

OK, so I did an experiment. The system works great in the warm weather and provides us with ‘hot/cold’ shock therapy in the winter. Basement stays cold in the winter (<40 F). What happens if I turn get the basement over 50 F?

HOT WATER, NO COLD SANDWICH! Woot!

Not sure why it works this way, just know that I can get hot water for real by boosting the basement temp a few degrees.

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Dated: 2008-12-15

My Rating: $$

by Doug (Alexandria, NH)

We have the winter ‘hot/cold sandwich’ problem. I’ve just started using Mickk’s troubleshooting process (cleaned the filter) so we’ll see what happens.

Couple of thoughts – wonder if they make sense.

Winter in NH. It’s been below freezing outside for about 2 weeks now.
Our basement (location of the heater) is pretty close to unheated and stays between 40 and 45 during the winter.
No clue what our cold water temp is but it’s cold.
If we run hot water in the shower for 5 – 10 minutes, the temp steadies out.
Since we only see this in the winter, what if we added a bit of heat to the cold water feed? I’m thinking about wrapping it with one of those things that keeps pipes from freezing just to see if upping the inbound water temp stops the cycling.

by Adam Kitz (Fort Saskatchewan, AB)

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Dated: 2008-11-09

My Rating: $$

by Adam Kitz (Fort Saskatchewan, AB)

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Dated: 2008-11-09

My Rating: $$

by Adam Kitz (Fort Saskatchewan, AB)

I find that when I’m in that shower, and have the temp control to the max hot (supposed to be 110 degrees) it does not seem that hot. It’s definitely very warm – but I can stand under it – no problem – the entire shower. Seems to me it’s more like 102 degrees.

Since the hot water comes out of the other faucets and showers much hotter than that (you can’t have the water on full hot and keep your hand under it), I’m wondering if there is some problem with the Rinnai and this particular thermostatic control. Has anyone had similar issues?

Fullfilled: N/A

Dated: 2008-08-26

My Rating: $$

by Joe (Chicago Metro, IL)

You know I see a common thread here.
People who always think a skilled Plumber makes too much money and therefore charges too much.
Anyone price stainless steel vent pipe? Or calculate the volume of gas needed to fire a 34-40,000 BTU tank heater vs. a 199,000 BTU tankless? Or what about the multiple visits to your home to size, sell and install the units. And while those people are driving to your home do they get paid or do they appear there by N/C magic.
Filters for sediment, softeners for hardness and iron, annually exercising the valves so they work and CLEANING the inline filter annually. And finally, corroded pipes with low flow, dirty aerators, restrictors all beyond a Salesman’s or Plumbers view.
Listen the lowest restrictor I know of is 1.6 GPM (lavatory) and clean that will activate a .5 – .8 GPM tankless unit unless the supply is fouled.
DO YOUR HOMEWORK…and a reputable person like myself will tell you No when you really can’t put in a tankless and yes when you can. With 5+ year old installs out there I still have zero callbacks if maintained well by homeowner.
And Descaling is an admission you have poor water quality and it would be a major reason NOT to install one.
And Tanks…. Gas or Electric they last only about 6-8 years now…about as long as the Mfrs warranty.
Not like the 14 year old electric tank my folks raised 6 kids on.

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Dated: 2008-08-25

My Rating: $$

by Larry (Plantation, FL)

I just installed a Rinnai R75 propane water heater and love it. There are a few points that people have to be aware of before makeing the leap to tankless.
1. You have to meet the minimum water flow for the unit to turn on. For mine it’s 0.6 gallons per minute. So, if you want hot water you have to want it and let it flow. Trickles will not turn on the water heater. You can mix with cold water but the hot water flow has to be enough.
2. 3/4 inch water piping is recommended to ensure proper water flow. 1/2 inch piping will get you hot water faster because there’s less water in the line to purge. However, realize that the the time needed is really no different than the time needed for a tank heater to purge the cold water…
3. If you have low water flow shower heads you might want to remove the flow reducer in the shower head to ensure you meet the minimum water flow requirements. Or buy new show heads.
4. If water flow is not high enough you may have a blocked faucet head so clean it out. You’ll be amazed at the amount of debris that can collect.
5. 3/4 inch gas piping is required.
6. Flush the system at least once a year to remove lime!
If you read the specs and adjust your water usage up you shouldn’t have problems. If you have hard water then soften it and flush the system more frequently. I would bet that the hard water will shorten the units life so you may want to reconsider.

by Dave (Gainesville, FL)

I had a Rinnai system installed two weeks ago. It was between that and a Noritz. Quotes were all over the place but I settled on one contractor that really seemed to have a good handle on the technical details and was less about the sale. They were also listed on the Rinnai website as a certified dealer.

I ended up going with 2 Rinnai R75LSi (5 bathrooms). The install had a few bumps but the contractor quickly handled all issues (I can clearly see how having a good contractor can make all the difference). The install was relatively simple. A 1.25” gas line was already available, interior units were installed but vented horizontally using Rinnai’s basic venting kit, and the location was close to where the existing water heater (50 gal gas tank) was. Two remote controls (one upstairs and one downstairs) were installed.

Although I have not stress tested the units, the performance is fantastic. I find the unit produces hot water just a little cooler than its set point. I have a high-quality digital thermometer from Thermo Works and it would read about 116-7 if I had the unit set to 120. You do wait about 30 seconds longer for water and need to adjust your usage habits a little to maximize the benefit but it isn’t a big deal. The units seem to work with all types of demand (warm water coming from single faucet to wash hands all the way to very hot water for the clothes/dish washers). The units are very quiet as well. I can barely tell they are on even when standing right next to them. The house uses cpvc pipe (3/4” main line, 1/2” to bathrooms).

In my area of Florida, the water comes from the aquifer. Great because we get fairly constant year round temps (~70) so the unit won’t work too hard in the winter, but bad because it is full of limescale. We installed bypass valves on both units so I can hook up a recirc pump with a vinegar solution once a year to remove the scale. This is essential maintenance if you have hard water from what I hear.

While I expect to see a savings in the gas bill, I doubt I will ever recoup my costs. Of course, these units could last 15-20 years with good maintenance and who knows what natural gas might cost by that point!

Fullfilled: N/A

Dated: 2008-07-04

My Rating: $$

by Roger (Myron, AR)

I live very rurally, and basically the word is “use this plumber”. Although it took forever to get ahold of him, finally meeting up, I told him I wanted a tankless propane hot water heater, and had been looking at another brand.

He said, “Rinnai, you won’t regret it”. So I said, “Let’s do it”.

Installation took two hours, and it’s great. Love the fact that I’m not heating water 24/7, and that showers can follow one after another.

An important note to add…..everybody’s pretty honest with each other out here, because we’re all we got, and he told me up front, “If you didn’t have a water softener, I’d try to talk you out of a tankless”.

by Keith (Yorkotn, SK)

I have had my Rinnai for about 3 months now. I think it’s the greatest. I replaced a 40 gal electric tank water heater. I know I will see savings, I’m just not sure how much yet. I don’t experience any cold sandwiches or loss of pressure. It might take a couple extra seconds for the hot to come to the tap, that is it. Hardly noticable. I did have my Rinnai installed by a certified plumber.

We had a Rinnai R94LSi unit installed last week. I was concerned because I had read all the negative reviews here, but we decided to go ahead and give it a try. I am completely satisfied with the new unit. It comes on within 4 seconds of opening the spigots, and takes no longer than our old tanked water heater to reach the faucet. We have a 3 bedroom, two bathroom house. I tested the unit with both sinks, one bath, and the kitchen sink on, and I had hot water for each. I haven’t noticed any reduction in water pressure. The unit is very quiet, just a slight whirring fan sound that I can only hear if I am close to the utility room. The unit has two flame levels, so it doesn’t come on at full power if you just need to wash your hands in the sink. Overall, the only difference I notice is that I can shower immediatly after my wife without running out of hot water. The unit is also great for freeing up space in our cramped utility rooom. Oh yeah, I’m NOT an installer or salesman, just a satisfied customer.

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Dated: 2008-04-18

My Rating: $$

by Carl Farg (Austin, TX)

JH -

In the past year, have you cleaned the system per the manufacturer’s recommendations (outlined in your owners manual)? You could have a build up inside the unit. This is especially true if you have hard water.

I clean & purge my unit 2 times per year. I also have a water softener because the water in Austin is pretty hard.

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Dated: 2008-04-17

My Rating: $$

by Donald (San Jose, CA)

Im putting in a Rinnai R98 and have some left over 1” Copper pipes I’d like to use as my main hot water lines in the house. Is 1” too large for the hot water supply out of the Rinnai (which has 3/4” connection? Should I go down to 3/4”? My house has two bathrooms/std kitchen and laundry room with washing machine and sink.

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Dated: 2008-04-13

My Rating: $$

by David (New Philadelphia, OH)

Donald,
I would recommend the smaller the better on the outlet of the water heater. The bigger the pipe you have the longer the wait for hot water. It has to push all of that water out of the pipe before you get any hot water. That said, I have had my Rinnai for over a year and love it. I have 3/4 inch water lines.

It takes a while to get the water to the second floor, but it never runs out. I have found that the flushing the system with vinegar needs done more than once a year and keeps the unit running better.

I just installed one for my parents house. They have 1/2 inch pipe and it doesn’t take as long to get the hot water. They are very happy with it.

Tankless water heaters take a little getting used to, but once you do they are great!

Fullfilled: N/A

Dated: 2008-04-13

My Rating: $$

by JimLoder (Reading, PA)

We purchased the unit about 8 -10 months ago on the recomendation of our plumber. It was professionally installed and we have had nothing but problems since then. The cold water sandwhiches are the most annoying. It goes from scalding hot to freezing cold. The unit constantly drips out of the pressure release valve and initially would “blow” water out of the valve whenever used. The wait time for water is twice as long as with a standard water heater.

The plumber was told about the drips and “blowing” and he installed a pressure reducer on the cold water inlet. This stopped the “blowing” but not the drips.

I have no confidence in the plumber anymore and will not be using his company ever again (Essig Plumbing, Reading, PA).

We have a standard plumbing system installed in the early 1960’s and our water is hard. Retrofitting the system is not an option. Does anyone have any suggestions?

I have to accept some of the blame because I did not do any research on tankless systems prior. However, I needed a new water heater right away and followed the plumbers recomendation. I anticipate going back to a standard water heater a taking this as an expensive learning experience.

Jim
jdlod@verizon.net

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Dated: 2008-04-12

My Rating: $$

by do it (denver, CO)

federal heating & plumbing in denver .. you can order what you need from them. Do your homework before you go they are one to two days out on whatever you need to order. I did a R85

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Dated: 2008-04-10

My Rating: $$

by Laith (Parker, CO)

I just bought the R75LSi water heater and do not yet have all of the venting materials to install this myself. I want to purchase this in a store in Denver if possible. It seems I have to order every place I look Do you know of any stores that sell the parts, or this water heater in Denver? I want to make sure I buy the right parts at the store.

laith40@hotmail.com
Thanks,

Laith

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Dated: 2008-04-08

My Rating: $$

by Laith (Parker, CO)

laith40@hotmail.com
Thanks,

Laith

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Dated: 2008-04-08

My Rating: $$

by JH (OAK RUDGE, NC)

We have a new house and recently have begun to see issues with our Rinnae takless heater after just a year of operation. The issue is we sometimes get no ht water at all or the temperature fluctuates. We have had the plumbers back and while they are there we get hot water and they tell us to monitor the situation. How many cold showers do I have to take ??? This has only recently strarted to happen and we had them install a water filter a month ago.

by Karl W (Edmonton, AB)

I have a C53i. Only had it for a week. Unit works well on Edmonton’s chilly tap water, but it does take 8 seconds or so for the water to get up to set temperature (testing right out of the heater). The Bosch unit that my relatives have in Europe ramps up much faster.

Regarding noise: It’s not loud at all; about as loud as a fridge. The inducer motor in my furnace is much louder.

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Dated: 2008-04-01

My Rating: $$

by Joe Friedl (Cincinanti, OH)

We bought the Rinai when we built our house in 2002. While we enjoy being able to take multiple showers, run the dishwasher etc., the unit has been nothing but problems for us. It seems that evey year we need to get somebody in to fix something with the unit, and each year we need to find somebody new because the people who ere certified last year don’t seem to be certified this year and so on. We can not anybody in the Cincinanti who has been servicing these untis for an extended period of time that know what they’re doing. It’s very frustrating.

First, the unit would go cold for no reason. If we turned the hot water off for a couple minuts and turned it back on it would warm up. It finally strted throwing a code, a 12 I believe, and they replaced heating unit. It doesn’t get cold much like it used to.

Last year it decided to spring a leak. They had to replace what seemed liek half the guts of the unit. Once again, the people we used previously were no longer listed as certified. We found somebody who seemed like they would be reputiable to find out they have only worked on maybe six of the units. The guy had a heck of a time working on it.

Now the thing is vibrating something fierce. All the pipes and the whole house now shake when we turn it on. It doesn’t do it everytime but when it does, the whole wall vibrates. I’ve even heard the noice outside. So now I’m face with finding somebody to service it and I don’t have clue. The Rinai people themselves are useles. We call them up and all they do is refer us to their website for a list of certified repair people. Nowhere does it provide you with any information of how long they’ve been certified, how many units they’ve worked on or a satisfaction rating. In a nutshell it is frustrating as heck. I would not buy another of these units again as any savings is being eaten up or even outpaced by repair bills. Next time I’m going to try the Bosch.

Fullfilled: N/A

Dated: 2008-03-30

My Rating: $$

by Canuck (Sarnia, ON)

Amanda,

I had an installer from Sarnia install the new 7.5 Rinnai unit about 2 weeks ago. It has been great but I’m on Lake Huron water so the hardness is very moderate. i was replacing a 23 year old rental unit and planning to live in the house for a long time. I also have a hot tub that it will be great to fill. Set is at 106 deg and turn it on full open and fill and use immediately.

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Dated: 2008-03-30

My Rating: $$

by Amanda (chatham, ON)

Hey Everyone,

I’ve just been reading through some the reviews here and had a couple questions.

First of all, I think I have only seen one or two people from Ontario Canada post on here and I was wondering if there is anyone else out there that has experience with this system up here. Its a lot colder here than in Texas or California.

Also I noticed some people mentioned it may be an issue with plumbing. My house used to be on a sulfur well before we purchased it so all the piping is actually 3/4” black plastic (the sulfur would have corroded the copper) we are going to be updating this to the new plastic piping available (called AquaPex) which we currently have running to our washing machine. Does anyone know if this would pose a problem for this heater?

Thanks,

Amanda

Dated: 2008-03-19

My Rating: $$

by Senor Obvious (Clute, TX)

It should be obvious from scanning the CUSTOMER reviews below what the problems are here:

1) Costs a small fotune, with install costing more than the unit in many cases
2) Takes forever to deliver hot water to shower/faucet
3) Sounds like a freight train when running
4) Alternates bursts of cold and hot water when running

Sounds to me like I’ll stay with my tank heater.

Fullfilled: N/A

Dated: 2008-03-12

My Rating: $$

by Arthur Huang (Qingdao, NT)

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Ateliving Trade and Industries Co., Ltd
Website: http://www.ateliving.com
Album: http://picasaweb.google.com/ateliving

Fullfilled: N/A

Dated: 2008-03-10

My Rating: $$

by Craig (Calgary, AB)

I’m surprised to read of so many negative responses. I put in a 2532 FFU 2 years ago to replace a 40 gallon tank, and I’d never go back. The Rinnai is quiet, and I was able to get rid of the pilot light and chimney from my old tank heater. I replaced my furnace at the same time to a high efficiency unit, which is also sealed air and exhaust. I had an energy audit done before and after and the inspector was amazed at how little air leakage there was after removing the chimney.

I’ve experienced none of the cold sandwich problems, and the hot water doesn’t take any longer to reach the tap than it did with the old tank. What I’m really happy about is that I can actually fill the bathtub instead of the water getting 3” deep and then going cold.

I’ve been able to run the dishwasher and have a shower at the same time and not noticed that the dishwasher was running. My water pressure didn’t change from before the installation. I do notice that in the winter I can’t have the washing machine fill and take a high flow shower at the same time, the shower flow rate does drop, but the temperature of the incoming water is also 2 degrees over freezing. The shower temperature doesn’t change, the flowrate just cuts back to what the heater can maintain.

by Tony (Clinton Twp., MI)

Install a Hot Water Lobster instead of a tankless heater! With a tankless you still must wait for hot water to travel from the heater to your faucet or shower. At only 9.95 The Hot Water Lobster gives you instant hot water to your tap! Time and water are no longer wasted as water runs down the drain while waiting for hot water.

Check it out at:
www.hotwaterlobster.com

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Dated: 2008-02-28

My Rating: $$

by Nate The Great (Steamboat Springs, CO)

As Far As it taking forever to get hot water, it has to do with hot water recirculation. We have used a 003 TACO Timer circ pump and the rinnai just purs. Great unit, if you have question regarding this installation email me at marshallsenterprises @ hotmail dot com

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Dated: 2008-02-26

My Rating: $$

by Nancy (Lawrence, KS)

We built a new 5000 sq ft house and upgraded our house to be somewhat green.
We did the green appliances , heating, cooling, and hot water. We went with 2 of the Rinnai systems. I will have to say that I love them once I get hot water.
There are several rooms in the house that take forever to get hot water. I can fill the kitchen sink full of water before it gets hot. So whatever I saved on my gas usage and bills , has now resulted in higher water usage and money. So now one has canceled the other one out. The only one that came out ahead on this deal was the manufacture and plummer.
Maybe tankless systems are designed for smaller houses.

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Dated: 2008-02-22

My Rating: $$

by Jason (Carpentersville, IL)

Whew! sorry to be amused by most of these reviews but just thought id give my two cents. My company has been a authorized Rinnai installer for about 5-6 years, we also have yet to repair a single one. I also have noticed that the majority of people that research the product the most are people considering doing it themselves, beware you will most likely end up with one of these complaints, because 95 % of the issues i hear are installation problems or lack of knowledge/ education from either the installer or salesmen as to what should be expected from the system selected. Im quite baffled by the complaints as we have never encountered any of thes problems, i have learned that one or two of their models did have the noise issue that was corrected. I would suggest getting 3 estimates, and the harsh reality is that the most expensive estimte is probably the guy that knows what he’s doing and will give you the best value. Expensive=Yes Endless hot water=Yes Long term savings=Yes

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Dated: 2008-02-19

My Rating: $$

by Walt (Sarnia, ON)

I have investigated the tankless and I asked the do I have enough gas capacity and the answer was yes. What causes the cold slugs? I have read the Rannai manual and if gasw piping is big enough and vent is good what is there.

I plan to have it installed professionally but I do not know what to watch for in the installation technique to avoid the potential problems.

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Dated: 2008-02-19

My Rating: $$

by Larry (Toronto, ON)

I’ve had this tankless heater for about 4 years now. Very relaible so far. Just a little delay in getting hot water, but got used to it.

by Jules Dahlman (Monterey, MA)

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Dated: 2008-01-27

My Rating: $$

by Sharon Stevens (Rock Hill, SC)

I’m not sure if this is a problem with the Rinnai. After moving into a brand new home I’m noticing a strong smell in the hot water. My husband thinks it smells like gas. My neighbor who has a Rinnai also has the same problem. My other 2 neighbors who have regular hot water heaters with tanks don’t have any odor in their water. Could this be caused by the Rinnai?

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Dated: 2008-01-26

My Rating: $$

by Mark (Sugar Land, TX)

I too want to switch over to a tankless. Had an estimate done today by a rannai certified installer. I was all excited before he arrived, now I am depressed.
The model I “was” interested in is the R94S. Rannai lists this unit at 99. I figured on adding money for piping, fittings, valves venting and 2 guys taking 6 hours total to install. In my mind I was thinking about 00 total since it it a pretty straight forward install.

The estimator came out, wrote the estimate. Just to install the Rannai and plumb it in would be 00….WOW!!

He also explained that a separate filter system was needed. I was given an estimate on 3 different filter systems and those ranged from 0 to 00.

By the time he left, I had an estimate. I was floored. With the Rannai plus the Nature’s Miracle whole house filter, I was looking at 00. Friends, I can buy a lot of tank heaters and pay for a lot of natural gas for 00.

I also find out that you have no hot water if there is a power failure unless you hook up an APC to your water heater.

It sounded like a great idea and I still may do it one day. The price, however,will need to come WAY down before I go this route. Beware if you are considering this move.

Fullfilled: N/A

Dated: 2008-01-23

My Rating: $$

by Steve Walters (Reno, NE)

I live in a fairly cold area (in the winter) at about 6000 feet and am building a new home. In my current home I have a 75gal hot water heater and a hot water recirculation system that basically “loops” the hot water line through the house back to the hot water heater. There is a circulation pump that keeps the hot water circulating through the hot water line loop so when you turn on the hot water, it’s hot within about a second.

Anyway, I was thinking about having the same type of system installed in my new home but put in a Rinnai that feeds hot water to the hot water heater. It’s basically a combination of both solutions…endless hot water without waiting for hot water at the tap but without the negative side effects like “cold water sandwiches”.

Yes I realize I won’t be getting all the energy savings of a tankless system because I will still have a hot water tank, but that’s not important to me. I just want to have a solution where I never run out of hot water with the benefits of a tank system and hot water recirculation system.

Anyone ever try this or have any thoughts?

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Dated: 2008-01-17

My Rating: $$

by jules Dahlman (Monterey, MA)

Rinnai R53 propane tankless water heater installed by trained installers 6 weeks ago.
Unit sounds like a NASCAR racer starting up for the first 1 minute of usage when cold. Plumbing done by expert plumbers. Gas line 3/4”, new gas regulator installed.
Flue dismounted and checked, dip switches adjusted to factory recommendations-and the roaring goes on! Drives my wheaton terrier wild! Technicians tried all morning ~~and still it roars. They are trying to get a replacement unit under warranty from Rinnai~~ but who knows? Jan.2008

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Dated: 2008-01-15

My Rating: $$

by Joe M (Rochester, NY)

Just had a Rinnai R75LSI installed, and so far I love it. I’m usually the last one in the shower, so I usually end up with lukewarm or cold water. Not any more!

I have the temperature on the Rinnai set at 130 degrees To test it’s performance, I ran 3 faucets on hot, full blast for 5 minutes. The temperature at each faucet is right on.

The reason I gave 3 stars instead of 4 is that it takes an additional 10 seconds for the hot water to get to the faucets, but it’s worth the wait.

I should mention that I had to run a larger gas pipe (1 inch), to accomodate rhe Rinnai because I will be trading my electric stove for a gas one soon.

Fullfilled: N/A

Dated: 2008-01-12

My Rating: $$

by Joe M (Rochester, NY)

One thing I forgot to mention. I have not experienced any loss of water pressure.

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Dated: 2008-01-12

My Rating: $$

by Larry (Omaha, NE)

We are considering installing a Rinnai 85 in a 2 story, 3200 sf home with two 1/2 baths. In reviewing these messages (more of a blog than reviews), I have learned about two problems: cold sandwiches and drop in water pressure.

by Brian (Sacramento, CA)

We switched to a tankless water heater a few weeks ago to gain valuable space in our kitchen as part of a major remodel—the old tank just took up too much space in our tiny two bedroom, one bath house. We talked to friends and neighbors about their tankless systems and felt like it was a great solution to our problems.

After spending a couple thousand on having the new system plumbed and installed, we were immediately disappointed by the pressure drop. Our old 40 gallon tank had no trouble providing ample pressure to our single bathroom, kitchen, and laundry. Not so with the new unit. We specifically bought an “upsized” unit because we wanted to ensure that we would have the extra capacity should we decide to add an extra bath in the future. As it is, though, there’s barely enough pressure to run one shower and one sink—let alone anything else in the house.

Our contractor has replaced the gas meter, all the gas lines, and all of the hot water lines—all in effort to boost our pressure to advertised levels, and all in vein. For a unit advertised to run “two showers and a sink” there’s just no way we have that kind of output. Operating ONE shower causes the bathroom sink pressure to plummet. Since the rest of the remodel is still under way, we have no idea how bad the pressure will be in the new kitchen and laundry areas, but we’re not optimistic.

by JMA (Denver, CO)

To those thinking of purchasing a Rinnai,

A Rinnai will not work in every application, don’t try to rework your existing plumbing or fuel delivery system to a point that negates the savings you will gain from the unit. Rinnai water heaters or any tankless water heaters are not a new fad, it’s what the rest of the world has used to heat their water for years. It is however new to the U.S. and can be difficult to install and have work correctly in a retrofit application. New gas meters or lines may need to be installed or new plumbing may need to be piped in order to maximize the benefits of a Rinnai. A Rinnai is NOT an “instant water heater,” it will NOT give you instant hot water at each fixture. It will actually add a few seconds to your wait time because of the way it is designed. They are designed to eliminate the standby heating and resulting fuel waste you get with a tank type water heating system.
The design also causes “cold water sandwiches” or “bullets” of cold water which are inherent with any tankless type unit. There are solutions to both the long wait and “cold water sandwiches.” A well trained plumber, familiar with tankless technology, should be aware of these solutions. Tankless water heaters actually perform differently in different areas of the country. Tankless water heaters (regardless of the brand) take city/well water and heat it very quickly to a set point temperature. The bigger difference between the incomming water temperature and the set point temperature, the lower the performance. The colder the water is that you start with, the less hot water you’ll get out of the unit (measured in Gallons Per Minute [GPM]), bottom line. On a brighter note, tankless water heating WILL save you money; provided the unit is sized and installed correctly. The hot water needs of restaurants, hotels, schools, six bedroom homes and condos can all be met as long as the units are sized and installed correctly. This is why Rinnai has taken the time and effort to ensure that qualified installers are out bidding and installing the product. With all that said, the ultimate responsibility to be reasonably educated falls on the homeowner, if a salesman tells you something that sounds too good to be true then it probably is. As I stated before, Rinnai and other tankless water heaters are not new, magical products. But they are wonderful products and a far superior way to heat water in both commercial and residential applications. A realistic idea of what they can and cannot do must be understood or you will become frustrated and broke.

Fullfilled: N/A

Dated: 2007-12-28

My Rating: $$

by Dennis (Oxford, MS)

We had a RINNAI system installed in our new home while it was being built. The unit was installed by plumbers who have done it many, many, times. They told us “most” plumbers insist on installing the RINNAI. We absolutely love it! I have not ran out of hot water one time in the last 3 months. The unit is supposed to be able to heat up to 8 gallons per minute but it can do more than that. The reason I say this is because we have had 2 showers going and my wife was at the kitchen sink. The water stayed hot at all locations. Also, the unit is in our master bedroom wall on the outside of the house and I have not heard it make any noise. It is completely quiet.

The only thing I can think about the negative comments here is that the system was not installed by experienced installers or possibly that the routing of the flow from the unit was not taken into consideration. Our hot water from the RINNAI goes straight to the kitchen and then splits off to the bathrooms and goes straight upstairs. There is a short lag time before the water gets hot, but we had that in our old house with the tank type heater too.

Trust me you cannot go wrong with this type of hot water system. It’s great.
Hope this review helps.

Fullfilled: Energy Rated Homes of Mississippi

Dated: 2007-12-23

My Rating: $$

by Experienced (Central, CT)

I am only putting below average rating because people tend to read the crappy reviews.

I have getting ready to purchase a Rannai and planning on doing it myself so I have been reading a lot of reviews. I keep seeing a semi-recuring issue.

Hot-Cold-Hot-Cold…

This is a common issue that even most plummers miss and this is a very common occurance after changing out a water heater…even the tank water heaters.

Most of the time your water is getting a lot hotter then your old tank. This can cause/assist and existing issue in the mixing valve on your washing machine to start letting water bypass through to the other side. It is more common then people think.

I discovered our issue when the wife was taking a shower and I was throwing a load of laundry in and accidently touched the cold water line and to my amazement it was HOT. Shut the valves off and the showers got hotter quicker.

I was ready to replace the water heater at that point…Instead, I needed a new washing machine…Might be your issue.

I will put up another post after I install my new Rannai.

Fullfilled: N/A

We installed the unit ourselfs and this includes all supplies needed (gas pipe, copper pipe, fittings, valves …) FYI Ferguson (where we purchased) had a great deal on the recomended valves which saved us a lot of time. The exhaust pipe was much cheaper cost then other brands, and only 1 hole which makes installing that much easier.
This past summer we had our 20 year old tanked H20 heater start leaking. We had planned on replacing with a tankless so when the dripping started in the tank we ordered the Rinnai R85. Granted this is overkill for Wisconsin as our winter water temp is quite low, however plan on filling a hot tub in summer.

My wife was less then thrilled with the extra cost, however she wasn’t going to be installing it so she let me do the project. 8-) Installing was done by myself and if you can sweat joints, and safely run gas line and possibly hooking up an electrical outlet you will be fine. I called in advance to make sure our gas meter could take the 180k btu rating which it could. I located a location on a wall nearest our two major users of hot water (bath tub and washer) and ran the cold 3/4 line and connected to the 3/4 hot line with copper pipe. Ran 1 in gas line and tee off to the 3/4 line needed for this unit. Don’t forget to put a dirt trip extending down with a cap.

We have a 20 month old child and two adults in our home. We have noticed 1/2 the therm rate used in the summer month over month so 50% reduction in gas usage. We purchased the unit from Ferguson and with all the supplies and current rate for Natural Gas (and 0 tax rebate) we will have payed off the additional inventment with interest in just under 2 years.

We love setting the heater at the temp we want our shower. If you have a large tub, you can purchase a second higher end controler and set how many gal of hot water you want (and temp of course) and it will fill the tub and turn off! Now that is handy! If you have the teenage kid running too much water for a shower, you could set it so they can’t camp out in a hot shower all day as well. Similar to the old tank unit execpt instead of getting a colder and colder shower it is warm till it turns off.

My wife is very happy now that it has been installed and she understands how to adj. the temp. and has commented as to why we didn’t change it out when we moved in this house last year! A guy can never win! Steve-o

Fullfilled: N/A

Dated: 2007-10-10

My Rating: $$

by Per-Ola (Kirkland, WA)

I’d stay away from ANY product that require a “special” (to the area) company to install it. Water heaters, even tankless ones are not rocket science. Any homeowner that is comfortable in working with gas lines, electriciy, and vent pipes can do this job.

Contractors charge way too much for these “tankless heater” at the moment because they still have not become a commodity.

That said, if you have your water heater in the garage, you will see savings (assuming your wife doesn’t take longer showers), but if your water heater sitsin inside the house (basement) you realyl do not have that much “heat loss”. Some of it goes up the flue, but a lot helps keep thge house warm.

I used the tankless heaters a lot in Southern Europe and in Northen Africa. A few years ago, sure, and technology has improved, but you might have issues with not enough (water) flow to trigger ignition, not enough gas flow to keep the burners running at 100%, and sicne the temperature rise is so dramatic and over a smaller area, you will see faster mineral buildup than in a “regular” heater.

I could still consider one of these units, but unilkely pay anything more than ,000 for a complete install, or a little more than twice the price of a standard 50 gallon unit with a 12 year warranty.

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Dated: 2007-09-29

My Rating: $$

by Charlie Beaton (Missoula, MT)

I just had a Rinnai R85 installed last week. It works really great. I would highly recommend it. We ran the dishwasher, sink and a bath all at the same time with plenty of hot water as well as pressure.

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Dated: 2007-09-09

My Rating: $$

by Southern Gent (Duluth, GA)

I have had two certified dealers out to my home to give me a quote on the 85 unit. Both dealers have quoted in excess of three thousand five hun dols. I hope that make it by the censor. if not one two next comma three four next. Take the two nexts and add two zeros.
I cannot understand how installation can amount to twice the price of the unit. Additionally, no on mentioned the fact I would more than likely need to replace my exisiting meter to accomidate the drastic pull the system needs to work.
They have all of the cost estimators and ROI (return on investment) calculators and no one factors in the cost to install. Seems a real used car sales approach to selling a unit.
What kind of savings are folks really seeing out there?

I asked about hidden costs and additional upkeep needed for the unit. I was told there is none. As I read comments posted here and I see where the install has bypass valves and such so you can service the system. People are being told to clean the filter to get better pressure.
How often do you need to service this thing? How often do you need to clean filters? What have been sources of “hidden costs” that people have seen in the real application of the product? Do you need to replace filters and if so, how much do they cost?
I am in Georgia, I am reading where people are unable to take showers and run the dishwasher at the same time.
What type of pressure loss are people seeing?

I guess I am seeing too many negitive experiences to justify the risk of it going horribly wrong (especially when you factor in the overall cost to get the system in place).
The other issue is that of not being informed by the installers of the additional time and money I am going to have to invest in keeping the thing running properly.

I read where someone had installed it themselves. While I am not a plumber, I have installed H2O tanks in the past. I have put in undersink mounted instant hot smaller units and have a full kitchen and two bathroom remodels under my belt (tubs, faucets the works) .
Is this something I can do myself? If I do it myself, does Rinnai walk away from supporting their unit?

It just seems to me that by stating you have to go through a dealer Rinnai is helping to create a monopoly on installation charges. I understand the position protecting the good name of their product in insuring proper installs but it seems to be a clear case of colusion to void a warranty unless you use a selected vendor to do the install and then have those vendors set the price.
It doesn’t sound like some of these vendors have stood behind their work in the negative reviews on this site AND WORSE it doesn’t sound like Rinnai came to the rescue of the customer by getting someone in there to fix the problem and protect the “good” name of the unit.

Any responses to the questions (one or all) above would be greatly appreciated.

Sincerely,
Southern Gent

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Dated: 2007-05-28

My Rating: $$

by Pete C (Cushing, ME)

Ok…im not shure who to be mad at here, me, the reject who sold it to me, or rinnai
me: apparently there was a grave misunderstanding here….i though that these heaters gave you endless hot water, and were the revolution. thats what i thought i heard anyway…
turns out, just like others have posted, the water pressure is UNSATISFACTORY!
and this sporatic hot-cold-hot-cold, drives me crazy, if you mess with it long enough….or open the faucet right under the unit(we will get to this), the problem goes away….NOW WHY SHOULD I HAVE TO DO THAT????

now as for the parisite who was sent to fix it: the 1st time he came down he did the test that ‘the rinnai school’ told him to do 1st to proove to the coustomer that the unit DOES INFACT WORK….he held a lazer thermometer right at the the main spout that comes right out of the bottem of the unit and filled a 5gal bucket…ok yes the temp stayed at 140 .f, then he said that it was related to my faucests cause i bought them at home depot….MY FAUCESTS? arnt they just valves?!? and why would not have problems with my cold water then….i called him back about 4 months later, insisting that it was not my plumbing and asked if he just wanted see what it was doing…he said this:
“NOPE. im going to proove to you AGAIN that this unit will sustain itself for 5 minuts” he proceeded to hook up a garden hose to the unit and run it out my door, at that point i asked “if what your about to do makes my problem go away and prooves nothing to me why are you going to do it, and why dont you take a look at what the acctual problem is?”
he says: “THIS is what rinnai tells me to test 1st…if it works then the unit works, im NOT GOING TO ARGUE THIS POINT WITH YOU”
of coure my responce to that wouldnt be allowed to post on this review
but that is why i am upset with rinnai to, shouldnt they say that these heaters are not good for ppl who want to take hot showers w/ good water pressure
and if there are ppl out there who have good luck w/ these heaters….THEN WHY THE HELL DOESNT MINE WORK?!?!?

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Dated: 2007-05-26

My Rating: $$

by Pete C. (Cushing, ME)

ok….it is acctually 4 hrs since my other review
after posting that last one i read a review by mickk…his problem solving sheet
facinating how somthing like a water filter could cause so much BS
i cleaned the filter….it didnt look bad but it did needed it(clogged filters are deceptive), now my water pressuse has almost double if not trippled and for whatever reason with that xtra volume of higher pressure the damn thing runs like a champ now, real test will be tomorrow morning but things are looking up
i can still only give this product 2 stars tho, cuz of that FOOL who gave me all that greif about fixin it….maybe im the fool for not checking that in the 1st place…but it IS hard tellin not knowin
and thanx mickk that faq was real helpful

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Dated: 2007-05-26

My Rating: $$

by Greg Guth (Frisco, TX)

I bought 2 gas units to replace my old tank water heaters about 5 years ago. One has been running perfectly ever since. (It is the least used system) The other went out after 3 years. Apparently hard water builds up in the controls in these units and gums them up. The rebuild kit to fix this is about .00 not bad but fins a plumber that will touch a tankless water heater. Good Luck!

These do need replacements of the water flow parts on a regular basis if you live in an area with hard water.

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Dated: 2007-05-22

My Rating: $$

by bob Carroll (Edmond (near Okla. City), OK)

Question: Building a new home and have to make a decision right away. There will be two hot water sources (tanks or tankless); one of them in the guest part of the house (only occasional bathroom usage).

A plumber has told our builder of a need for routine maintenance to prevent hard-water buildup—running something through the system once every 6 months or so. I need to know if that’s true; might it be true for the water in our area? Are there other maintenance issues that I should know about?

I’m thinking about going tankless in the guest area and tank to supply the main area (master bath, powder bath, kitchen). Only two adults in the home full time (empty nesters).

Answers and advice soon, please. It’s decision time on the house.

Installation faults such as undersized gas lines, cross connections etc are not covered. Thats why Rinnai wants to know the unit was installed by someone who knows their stuff.

It costs a fortune to send a tech a hundred miles only to discover the unit was installed by a cowboy who undersized the gas .

PS the wireless remotes have been a huge hit with my customers!

PLEASE SEND ANY QUESTIONS TO MMICKK@GMAIL.COM FROM NOW ON

HAPPY SHOWERING!

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Dated: 2007-04-19

My Rating: $$

by Brian (Newton, MA)

We have just installed a Rinnai Tankless water heater and the following is a summary of our experience.

Model: Rinnai R85 (or 2532FFU)

Region: Eastern Massachusetts (the house is 80 years old). The outside temperature has been consistently below 40 degrees since the installation.

Reason for this installation: Old Tank heater started to leak; want to save energy cost; Federal Tax Credit and local energy company rebate drove down the installation cost by a significant amount.

Elapsed time for this installation: ~5 hours.

Cost: We had to pay Nineteen hundred upfront (including the unit, which I’ve seen it going for a thousand on ebay). However, there is a three hundred dollars 2007 Tax Credit, and another three hundred dollars rebate from the gasnetwork, which make this installation about five hundred more than a tank replacement. I believe we can break even within 5 years, but the unit will last a lot longer than a tank heater.

Details of the installation: We did not have to do any electrical work, but we had to move the unit to the back side of the house and installed ventilation.

Review of the unit: We’re very happy with this unit. It’s everything as advertised so far. The outside temperature has been under 40F since the installation, so the incoming water is very cold. We have the water temperature set to 125F (Preset to 120F), and it’s been consistent. We do not have any “cold sandwich” issue. It does take a few seconds for the hot water to get to the fixtures, but it doesn’t take longer than the tank. The pipes are cold, so it wasn’t instant for the old tank either. We have not tried using multiple applications at the same time, and we’ll give that a shot later.

The operation is very quiet. The only thing you can hear is the ventilation fan. There isn’t a pilot light. It’s triggered by the water flow and uses electricity to fire up. We find this arrangement working very well so far.

Overall, we’re very happy that we have made the switch and will definitely do it again and recommend it to everyone we know. The only thing I may try is to buy the unit myself, and ask my plumber to charge an hourly rate which should save us another couple hundred dollars.

If you have any questions regarding our experience, please feel free to email me at brianz at techie dot com.

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Dated: 2007-04-15

My Rating: $$

by David (New Philadelphia, OH)

I also installed a Rinnai heater myself which I purchased from ebay. I installed the R53i Plus. The thing works better than I expected. I have an older house (1922), but I updated all of the water lines to 3/4 inch copper and ran a 1” trunk line of gas within 5’ of the unit before goosing it down to 3/4”. It takes about 15-20 seconds to get hot water from my basement to my 2nd floor shower. I was very leary after reading this forum, but would highly recommend the unit. It was actually a very easy install aside from relocating the pipes.

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Dated: 2007-04-12

My Rating: $$

by Carl Farg (Austin, TX)

Deborah – Of course your technician would tell you that – they want your money. If you read the warranty, it just states that a self install “may” void the warranty. This is true because if it is installed incorrectly then it is not their fault. But, with the money I saved by installing it myself I could go buy another 1 or 2 units myself and that is only IF they would not honor the warranty. I would argue strongly that I have installed it correctly and demand that they show me what (if anything) I have done incorrectly. In either situation, I win. In fact, I would argue that I have installed it better than the recommended guidelines because I have placed additional gate valves in the line which will make servicing even easier that the recommended set up.

As to buying a unit – I bought a new, in box unit on ebay. I saved a ton from there as opposed to buying it from a local seller. I submitted my warranty information just like anyone else does. The warranty card does not even ask “who” installed it. While I appreciate your concerns, I think they are a mute point.

Lastly – After having the unit installed and running on a daily basis I have only noticed one thing different from a tank water heater. The hot water takes a bit longer to get to the point of usage. And I can not stress enough how minor this is. I would estimate that it takes an extra 30 seconds and that is it. I have run the shower alone, run two at a time, run one and then have another start, run one or two simultaneously and had an appliance kick in and I have never experienced any fluctuation in either water temp or flow rate (I do not use low-flow heads). So far, this thing has been slicker than snot and i have never had any problems with it. The only thing I could say regarding those that have problems is that it must not be installed correctly.

by Deborah V (Westborough, MA)

To Carl who just installed his own Rinnai It was my understanding from Rinnai and the Rinnai salesman that only qualified Rinnai technicians who have been trained and certified via Rinnai training classes are allowed to install the units. I am schocked that as a non-qualified Rinnai tech (which I assume you are) you could even purchase a unit let alone be allowed to install it. And certainly the warranty wont be applicable.

Fullfilled: N/A

Dated: 2007-04-09

My Rating: $$

by Graham (Waterloo, ON)

I use my Rinnai for domestic hot water, and five loops of radiant in floor heating (though as separate heat exchanger and pump system). The only issues i had with it related to not installing the remote controller for my shower, because I was lazy, and thought it would be fine. So the shower would turn cold, since I was mixing cold water with the hot and not getting enough flow. Now, I set my shower controller to a blissful 97 degrees, turn on full hot, and never get any fluctuations in pressure or temp whatsoever. This is true if the dishwasher, laundry, and all the radiant floor loops are cranking at the same time. It is not a do it yourself simple replacement for the ol 50 gallon tank, true, but it is the perfect solution for my needs. Very quiet, very efficient, small, and has worked seamlessly for 3 years now. Remember that if you have an old, poorly plumbed house with galvanized pipe, most of your flow and loss of heat problems will stem from that, not the heater unit.

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Dated: 2007-03-03

My Rating: $$

by Bart (College Station, TX)

Anyone noticed that no one south of North Carolina has had a problem with this unit in these reviews? I’m wondering how many folks are expecting more of a temperature rise than the unit they bought can provide.

A friend of ours having a r85i that manages his household needs very well, prompted me to look into this more closely for our home. I am going to look into the recirc info, though, and also double check the high-efficiency washer and dishwasher to make sure it’ll ask for enough water to turn the system on.

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Dated: 2007-02-26

My Rating: $$

by michael (Baldwin, NY)

I just installed a Rannai 2520ffu. I am having problems with the initial start after the unit has been off for an hour. The first thing in the morning or just an hour after last use, it goes from hot to cold for about 5 minutes. Then after shuting the hot water on and off 3 -5 times the unit runs like it should. I dont get it! I see the flame on the left fire, then all flames fire, then the left side stays on and right side (flame directly in front of window) goes out then total shut off then cycles again.

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Dated: 2007-02-25

My Rating: $$

by Fritz (Alexandria, VA)

I decided against the Rinnai because the contractor wanted 00 for the turn-key installation of one unit. I bought a Paloma for00 and installed it myself but it took a lot of research. I already had 2psi gas but had to upgrade the meter and regulator to accommodate the higher bursts of gas usage (basically doubling my gas consumption with the 200K Btuh unit). I installed a larger than necessary regulator (500cfh versus 250, roughly) at the appliance to go from 2psi CSST to 7” wc and 1” black pipe for the last 5’ of the connection so I know I am not starving it of gas. It’s on an outside wall so it’s not starving for air. It’s quiet when it runs but noisy-ish when it is purging after a run of hot water. I have not experienced any cold water sandwiches yet but have a plan if I do. I will run a second hot water line, probably 1/2” (instead of 3/4”) through a shorter route-effectively splitting the sandwich (if it occurs). I have to say that it has been a massive crash course to understand all the gas pressure, water pressure, backflow/check valve, venting, breathing, condensation issues and you can’t rely on ANYONE but yourself to dot all the I’s and cross all the T’s (or it’s called, “luck”~~or you know mickk). I am so-o-o lucky that I have had an easy-access installation location in an unfinished basementand that I have done gas and water plumbing, carpentry, electrical, etc. before because it’s not a trivial DIY project. I love doing this stuff but it is still nerve-wracking at times~~the worst of which is dealing with suppliers who’ll only sell to “licensed plumbers” even when those pros will tell you all the corners they’ll cut to make it a fast job for them (because they think you don’t know they’re cutting corners). Read the manuals of everything (including the regulator) they say they’ll install. Don’t let them cut out drip loops, even if the inspector may pass it. (Who wants to take a chance of a malfunctioning ,000 unit for the in additional pipe? Also, get pressure test ports on both sides of your regulator. Another well-spent.) Talk to the building inspectors. Give them every opportunity to help you get a safe and workable installation. Give yourself every chance to get it right. Despite all my efforts I didn’t know until I cranked mine up how much noise the fan would make when purging-after heating. Oh, and *do* keep the old unit online until you have the new one running right if you have the opportunity.

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Dated: 2007-02-23

My Rating: $$

by Deborah V (Westborough, MA)

To Carl who just installed his own Rinnai… It was my understanding from Rinnai and the Rinnai salesman that only qualified Rinnai technicians who have been trained and certified via Rinnai training classes are allowed to install the units. I am schocked that as a non-qualified Rinnai tech (which I assume you are) you could even purchase a unit let alone be allowed to install it. And certainly the warranty won’t be applicable.

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Dated: 2007-02-23

My Rating: $$

by Carl Farg (Austin, TX)

Installed the 53i this weekend and the installation was a breeze. The hardest part was extracting the old tank and dealing with all of the corrosion – what a drag.

The installation started by taping the mounting diagram to the wall and marking the locations for the wall anchors. I drilled out the wholes using the recommended drill bit, pounded them in place and went to get the unit. This was a bit heavy to hold in place with one hand while I screwed in the bolt, but hell, I’m a guy – I don’t need help < :-)

Once it was in place and leveled it was time to make the connections. This was both simple and difficult; I’ll explain. It really can be as easy as just connecting all the hoses and turning it on, but to do the connections correctly take a bit more ingenuity. The directions will get you to the basic install, but to service the unit annually you will need access to the inlet & outlet so that you can circulate the de-scaling fluid (vinegar) thru it. My final solution looks like this:

Outlet: A 3/4” ball valve, a 3/4” tee (with a outlet connected to the horizontal arm), a second 3/4” tee (with a gate valve on the horizontal arm of the tee), and finally the pressure relief valve at the bottom.

Inlet: A 3/4” ball valve, a 3/4” tee (with a outlet connected to the horizontal arm), a second 3/4” tee (with a gate valve on the horizontal arm of the tee).

Gas: shut off valve, 3” extension, 3/4” tee (with the gas inlet on the horizontal arm), a 3” extension and an end cap.

Exhaust vent was a 90 degree elbow out of the wall.

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Dated: 2007-02-21

My Rating: $$

by Barry Dodson (Orlando, FL)

I HAD A RINNAI TANKLESS HOT WATER SYSTEM INSTALLED APPROXIMATELY 1 YEAR AGO.

PLUSES: UNLIMITED HOT WATER. CUT MY GAS BILL IN HALF. TAKES UP 1/4TH OF THE SPACE A STANDARD HOT WATER HEATER DOES. ENVIRONMENTALLY FRIENDLY.

NEGATIVES: SEEMS TO TAKE A LITTLE LONGER TO GET THE HOT WATER TO THE FAUCET. THE VENTILATION SYSTEM TO INSTALL ON AN INTERIOR WALL IS COSTLY (MOUNT ON EXTERIOR IF YOU CAN).

OVERALL OPINION: I LIKE IT.

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Dated: 2007-02-19

My Rating: $$

by mickk (melb, AL)

OK here it is, the checklist for Rinnai tankless water heaters.

Ok so you have a unit.

First thing I want you to do is turn off the cold water inlet uunder the unit. Now turn on every hot tap in the place, any flow other than a trickle is a crossed connection. Its a common problem. Got flow? call your plumber and abuse the (*^% out of him.

Ok since the water is off, remove the filter, its behind the brass screw head under the unit, lookis like a lil white cylindrical cage, clean it and clean it once a month.

OK, now turn on a hot tap, have someone lok in the peep hole on the unit, now turn on every other gas appliance in the joint full blast. Does the flame drop? if so you have an undersized gas pipe.

Does your unit play up on cold mornings? Put a towell soaked in hot water over the regulator on you gas meter, does this fix the problem? If so you have a sticky regulator. Call the gas company. Abuse the &^$&%# outta them and get it replaced.

Does it go hot cold in the shower? If so, are you mixing in cold water? if yes, the hot flow is too low, install a controller and use the hot tap only.

Got flick mixer taps? instal a controller.

Do you have an internal unit and it plays up when its windy? Its not flued properly, the clearances are not correct. Call the Installer and abuse him.

Does it simply not get hot enough and dribble? do the peep hole test above, you might have an undersized gas line.

Does it cut out when you only have the tap opened a little? Its low flow, it needs more water going through it.

It doesnt work at all. Check the power point and is the controler turned on?

It doesnt work at all when its cold? Are your pipes frozen?

It works fine except in the shower? check taps as above and install a controller.

It doesnt work in the morning and I live in a complex. Check the peep hole as above, you might need a bigger regulator.

My cook top goes out when the hot water is on. You need a bigger gas line.

The flow has stopped to a trickle. Has there been any plumbing work done or gas work in the street? check the filter.

It just dies. Is there anything leaning ahgainst the unit?

It wont work. has there been a storm? a power surge? then you need a service call. The PCB may be fried.

It goes hot cold and I checked all the above. It may be the gas valve sticking. Service call.

If you do not fit in any of the above categories, it may be a fault with the unit itself. Service call.

It takes forever to get hot water. If the pipe under the unit is hot, then you have one miserable hot water line that does a lap of the house before it gets to that tap. But the unit is only a few feet from the tap? Its doing a lap of the house believe it or not.

It starts in the middle of the night? Its backflow, call the plumber.

I smell gas when its running. Thats flue gasses, not gas.

I waste a lot of water before the hot comes out. See above, install a recirculating pump.

Its fine, but its too cold when it gets to the tap. Service call, the temp needs to be upped inside the unit.

None of the above?

email me!

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Dated: 2007-02-16

My Rating: $$

by Deborah V (Westborough, MA)

My advice to anyone thinking about purchasing a Rinnai tankless hot water system is to think long and hard and do LOTS of homework before you buy it. Try to find someone who has one and visit the home and try it yourself. And be sure that the place where you try it is similar to the situation where you will be using yours. I have learned that Rinnai installation/satisfaction in new construction is different than in existing structures. And find out how many units they have and how many of those extra cost recirculators they have. Yes, it’s a hassle but it may save you from the nightmare I’m having with mine.

I had a Rinnai tankless system installed in 12/06 when I moved into an older home and found out that the old tankless hot water boiler system was not working. As others have said, buying the Rinnai was one of biggest mistakes I’ve ever made. The install cost a fortune because I also had to install a propane tank and all the related plumbing. I did all of this based on my interest in resource conservation but I didn’t realize I would be trading one resource for another and I never expected the inconvenience as well as the incompatibility with my appliances.

While the Rinnai may save on fuel as compared to hot water tanks, it sure doesn’t conserve water. I am amazed at how much water I have to use to get hot water initially and then for any other hot water task within just a few moments. Someone else gave examples such as washing/rinsing pots and pans or any cleaning task that requires repeated trips to the faucet for hot water. Each trip back results in a ‘blip’ of hot water (depending on how long in between), followed by a period of warm water, followed by a period of cold water, then a period of warm water and, finally, hot water.

When I give my toddler grandson a bath I fill the tub and then ten minutes later when I’m ready to rinse him off, I have to run the water in the bathroom sink to get warm enough water and I have to rinse him with water from the sink because if I try to use the tub faucet he’ll have to suffer one of those awful “cold water sandwiches.”

Nobody told me about the “cold water sandwiches” when I was in the process of buying the unit. The tech/salesman just raved about the system. And everything I read up to that point was positive. Unfortunately I didn’t find this website until very recently when I went looking to find out if I was the only one who was having Rinnai troubles.

When I first called the tech to try to find out why the water would run warm/cold so quickly after shutting the hot water off, he laughed and told me that I had experienced “the bullet” and the “partial bullet” a.ka. the cold water sandwich. He swears he told me about the bullets while giving me the Rinnai sales pitch but if he had explained it to me I NEVER would have gone to the expense of purchasing/installing the unit.

And I wasn’t told that the Rinnai won’t work with my new (very expensive) water conserving washing machine and dishwasher. When I complained about that to the local Rinnai distrubutor I was told that I shouldn’t be doing hot water washes anyway! I’m sorry but I WANT to use hot water when I’m washing the grandkids’ bedding that was soiled when they had the flu and we were changing bedding every few hours!

And the tech told me that I could do a hot water wash and have hot water for the dishwasher if I just run them both at the same time WHILE I take a shower. Or, I could just keep the hot water running (full force of course) in the utility or kitchen sink while I’m running the washer and dishwasher. Does anybody else see anything wrong with this? IMHO….it’s crazy! I have a septic system. I bought the extra expensive water conservering appliances to conserve water but I’ve got a suupposed energy conserving Rinnai tankless hot water system that forces me to use MORE water to get hot water! The tech said that the issue of water conserving appliances has never come up his Rinnai training courses so he didn’t know that it would be a problem.

I have also been told to turn the unit up to 140 degrees. Everything else I read tells me that hot water should not be higher than 120 degrees (my current setting) to conserve energy and avoid scalding. And, besides even at 140 I’m told there will still be the “cold water sandwiches.”

And in my case it can’t be said that the unit was installed improperly because the tech has been back to check it and he reported back to the local distrubutor and Rinnai that the unit is working exactly as it is supposed to. The local distrubuter told me to sue the tech AND Rinnai if I wasn’t satisified. The tech/installer who, by the way, told me repeatedly how many Rinnai trainings he has been to, has offered to by the unit back for the 54 I paid for it but I am on my own for repair of the hole left in my ceiling and the hole cut to the outside of my house for the venting and then I have to have all the piping removed. And apparently after the distributor told me to sue the tech, he called the tech and advised him to go see his attorney because I was going to sue him! Whereas before the tech agreed to remove the unit and buy it back for my cost and fix the holes, now he says his attorney has told him not to come onto my property again because it’s a “hostile environment”! So…I have to pay a licensed plumber to remove the Rinnai unit. But, in some defense of the tech, he says he will still buy the unit back for my cost. Money that I will put toward the necessary repairs to my home as well as installation of a traditional propane hot water tank.

A Rinnai company rep was initially very helpful in trying to get the matter resolved but now has made it clear that the unit is working properly according to the tech’s report and therefore they have no further responsibility. But she did remind me that if I have any other problems with the unit I am always welcome to call the company back. Ha ha. And she also says that Rinnai’s websites clearly explain the cold water sandwich effect. I haven’t been able to find it yet.

by Don Roper (Coeur d'Alene, ID)

We had our heating contractor install two Rinnai R85 hot water heaters (side by side) in our new 5 bath home. In the master bath the shower is designed for two people, each person has 5 spray heads, for a total of 10 heads. Our fear was if we used a conventional system we would run out of hot water too quickly, hence the decision to try the Rinnai.

It was the first tankless hot water heaters the contractor had ever installed. But thankfully our plumber was very knowledgeable about the genere if not about the Rinnai brand. We love the circulating pump that is turned on by a sensor that detects electrical current in any bathroom, utility, or kitchen that has a light on. And the master shower has plenty of hot water.

There is one problem however. We’ve had a lot of air in the water lines. The plumber installed a release valve which took care of about 50-60% of the problem. Now he says the next step, a more expensive fix, needs to be some sort of diaphram (0 part, plus labor) to shock/jar more air out of the water.

Our building inspector told us he would not pass such a large house (5 bath, 2 utilities, 2 kitchens) with just a tankless hot water system, so from the start we designed in a regular tank to pre heat the water to 70-80 degrees. As a result, we don’t really know how much to credit the Rinnai heaters for the endless supply of hot water. But we do know a whole mess of people can take a shower at our house, and there’s absolutely no incentive cut it short.

Fullfilled: N/A

Dated: 2007-01-30

My Rating: $$

by MICKK (MELB, AL)

i HAVE BEEN KINDA OVERWHELMED WITH QUESTIONS SO WILL BE WRITING A PROBLEM SOLVING CHART AND POSTING IT HERE IN THE NEXT FEW DAYS, SORRY TO THOSE I HAVE NOT REPLIED TO IN A TIMELY MANNER, MY FACTSHEET WILL SOLVE 99% OF YOUR PROBLEMS, STAY TUNED!

Fullfilled: N/A

Dated: 2007-01-24

My Rating: $$

by MICKK (MELB, AL)

KEN, your guests are mixing water, they are using the hot tap and the cold tap, the flow of cold is greater than the hot, the unit shuts down and or cycles on and off.

by Hugh Greenwood (Saltspring Island, BC)

We have had a Rinnai tankless heater on our boat for 15 years with never a problem, until now. The problem is my fault, as I dropped the drain plug and cannot retrieve it. I must get a new one but have had no help from the Rinnai web site in my attempt to get a new one. Does anyone here know of a Canadian supplier who may be able to rise to the occasion?

The unit is REU-502, part number ZHAA 0406SZ ‘screw tih washer’

HELP please!

Hugh Greenwood

Fullfilled: N/A

Dated: 2006-12-08

My Rating: $$

by mick (melboune, AL)

The Rinai is a great product. SamW I have a few tips for you.

Have someone stand at the unit, holding the hot water outlet pipe. Then have someone turn each tap on. The person holding the pipe at the unit times how long it takes the hot water out pipe to get hot. It should be about 15 seconds. If this happens, then the unit is operating correctly. The time it takes to get to the outlet is called “dead leg”. Many houses have only one hot water line, it does a loop of the house, so it can take a minute for the water to travel around the pipework, stopping all stations as it were.

If this is the case, it can be overcome by installing a “smartstart” from Rinnai or a ring main. These keep the water in the pipes hot at all times.

Most people that have problems with cycling hot water are “mixing” water. That is you turn on the hot tap, then mix in cold water. The hot water flow reduces to less than about 2.5 litres a minute, so the unit cycles on and off to avoid overheating and damaging the heat exchanger.

To combat this, all you need to do is install a controller/s. This means that you punch in the temperature you want on the controller and the unit makes that temperature. No need to mix in cold water.

You have no idea how great it is to have 75 degrees stored on my controller in the shower. I am guaranteed of that temp everymorning, its great!

cheers

mick the plumber

Dated: 2006-11-30

My Rating: $$

by Chris G (Runcorn, TX)

Rinnai Is the way forward for hot water supply and safety. The technology is far superior to anything else on the market. I have read several bad comments which will equate to installation problems and will have nothing to do with the unit. I install Rinnai units because you can preset the temperature to within 1 degree for instance at 43 degrees and the unit will produce that temperature forever therefore eradicating any chance of scalding.

Look, there is a REASON that NOBODY has these things. They are not ready for prime time use in the USA. Got a little apartment in Stockholm? Maybe this will do… go a 4 BR, 2.5 bath home in the ‘burbs, and you’d need 3 of these things. Learn from my expen$ive mi$take and stick to the tank. There is peace of mind in knowing that you will have hot water when you move the lever to the left.

Some folks have had good luck. However, more have not. If you do buy, keep your old system in place until the plumber proves it works. Don’t pay a penny until then.

Fullfilled: N/A

Dated: 2006-11-19

My Rating: $$

by Icon Development (Atlanta, GA)

Rinnai’s have been a good product, but on dual unit system with a re circ. pump they do not have the system down. Their sketch of the system has a seperate electric hot water heater on the loop, and the units outside the system. The problem occurs when the units fire on. There is a cold water gap in the line, so the user gets a burst of cold water a few mins in the shower. We have solved the issue by using a 10gal hot water heater for the loop and running the rinnai’s through the hotwater heater. Also rinnai’s do not work under .5 gpm and on a 2 unit system it may be .8gpm before they fire up. our 10gal setup also solves this issue. (electric heat for warm water usage) On super low vol. shower heads located far away from the units, we have had an issue on the units turning on. We have to take the low vol. restricters off and adjusted the anti scald device for more hot water. This has solved the issue. Eventhough there are some quirks to the system, they are great products.

Fullfilled: Southface Energy Institute

Dated: 2006-11-06

My Rating: $$

by Dianne Martino (San Jose, CA)

We have been using a tankless water heater for over 20 years. We live in a two story, 1,300 sq. ft. townhouse, and switched to a tankless when we remodeled our kitchen in order to gain counter space.

Our first and second units were Aqua Star. They worked well, excpet the first one had a 6-7 second delay before it came on. The second one came on instantly. With both units we could only get hot water in one location at a time. Since there are only two of us in the house, we were able to live with this.

Last week we installed a Rinnai 2532FFU natural gas unit. WE LOVE IT! It’s another step up from what we had. It provides hot water in more than one location at a time, and the water temp. can be set at the unit to go as high as 140 degrees. We have it set lower than that.

by Mark Hartman (Sammamish, WA)

We just had one installed…I am trying now to have it removed. The performance is a joke. It takes 2-3 times longer to get hot water to a tap. Temperature and flow fluctuate WILDLY if more than one tap is turned on. Neither of our showers will get hot at all. The unit is so loud, I can hear it in our home, even though it is mounted in the garage.

Overall, the 15-year-old hot water tank the Rinnai replaced outperformed this not-so-hot new technology hands down. I figure any gas savings we may be enjoying is being offset by all the water we’re wasting waiting for it to get hot.

And all this after spending a wad of cash to get the requisite gas meter upgrade (you’ll likely need more BTUs than older meters can deliver because the Rinnai sucks nearly 190,000 BTUs at full tilt—if your furnace is running at the same time, it’s a good bet your current gas meter can’t handle the load) and all new 1-inch gas pipe (our home had 3/4”...not enough to carry the volume of gas required for the Rinnai…)

So…buyer beware. Make sure you try this product out before taking the plunge. A big thumbs down as far as I’m concerned.

Fullfilled: N/A

Dated: 2006-05-20

My Rating: $$

by Joe Van Dusen (Ottawa, Canada, ON)

I work for a heating contractor that installs Rinnai tankless hot water heaters. To date I have been involved in about 50 installations. I dont sell them I just install them so this is not a sales pitch. I think they are great, we have installed them for just domestic hot water applications and we also get clients that want to include their infloor radiant heat system. The largest installation I have witnessed was a client ran his DHW, in floor heating, and 12 wall radiator heaters off his Rinnai system. They are quiet, cost efficient and relative easy to install and small enough install in closets which we have had to do on certain situations.

Fullfilled: N/A

Dated: 2006-03-02

My Rating: $$

by Ken Irvine (Knoxville, TN)

We installed a Rinnai Tankless Hot Water Heater several years ago. It has perfomed very well. We have never had any problems with getting hot water at multiple sites at the same time. We certainly never run out of hot water.

A tankless hot water heater does require some getting used to. It takes from a few seconds to a few minutes, especially in winter when the ground water is very cold, to get hot water. Also, you must insure that you are drawing enough water or the system may stop heating the water and you get only cold water.

We installed the system hoping to see a drop in our natural gas bill. We never say the drop because we installed it just as natural gas prices were starting to rise. We do believe that our natural gas bill has not risen as fast as it would have.

Overall the system works very well for us and we have recommended it to many or our friends. The initial investment seems to deter many people.

Fullfilled: N/A

Dated: 2006-01-27

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Product Specifications

Temperature controlled, continuous flow, gas hot water system.
Operation with or with out remote controls, mounted in kitchen, bathroom, etc.
Exhaust system: direct vent, forced combustion
Model number: REU-2532FFU-US
Weight: 48 lbs.
Energy Factor: Natural Gas: 0.82; Propane: 0.87
Thermal Efficiency: Natural Gas: 82%; Propane: 87%
Ignition system: direct electronic ignition
Water temperature control: simulation feed forward and feedback.
Water flow control: water flow sensor, electronic water control device, and electronic by-ass control device
Minimum/Maximum gas rate (Input Btuh): 15,000 BTU’S- 18,000 BTU’S Natural Gas or Propane
Electrical consupmtion: Normal 75 watts, Standby 5 watts, Anti-frost protecion 100 watts
Hot water capacity: 0.5 to 6.5 GPM (50 F rise); 0.7 to 8.5 GPM (35 F rise)
Temperature range (with remote): MIC controller, 96 -140 F; BC and BSC controllers, 96 – 120 F
Temperature range (without remote): 120 F (Factory default)
Approved gas types: Natural or Propane – Ensure unit matches gas type’s being installed on
Installation: Internal

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Rinnai Corporation

Rinnai tankless hot water system

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